Getting Same Night Lays & One Night Stands…

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IAmMaximus, over at the mASF boards, has a really good post up about how he goes about getting women to have sex with him the same night he meets them.

IAmMaximus writes:
After having tons of problems scoring club pulls over the first several years I was at this, I’ve actually managed to hook up with 5 over about the past 7 weeks (including 2 in one night). While I’m certainly no expert on them, here’s what I’ve learned that helps me score them:

1. Go out looking as good as you possibly can.

2. Be sociable/talk and flirt with everyone/play the numbers.

3. Be persistent, even if you’re blown out once or twice.

4. Have fun yourself and show her a good time

5. Flirt and then escalate nonverbally (EC, get close, caress hands–credit: 60)

6. Keep pulling her to go home with you. Don’t necessarily verbalize that you want to take her home for sex. Just focus on taking her home and tie it into whatever her state is. She wants to get something to eat? You’ll take her! She just wants to get out of there… no problem! Then, once you’ve got her away, the sex will “just happen.” Don’t be afraid to persist and keep asking.

7. When you’re taking her home, keep up the kino the whole way. Keep caressing hands. Put your hand on her thigh and finger her if she’s in your car or sitting next to you on the subway, etc.

8. Get her home and just keep kissing and making out (pay attention to kissing her neck!) while working on getting a finger into her pussy. If she’ll let you put a finger there, more will follow.

That’s it. Nothing complex about it. I don’t worry about DHV, negging, canned material, special openers, etc. I just open, have fun with her, escalate, and pull and pull until I take her home.

Now, I’m NOT a particularly attractive man, so don’t go bullshitting that this only works for me because I must be good looking. Truth be told, I’m fat, sort of hairy, and I have impressive manboobs. No girl with working eyes would ever drool over seeing me shirtless, yet several have been gladly fucking me in recent weeks. Physically, I’m maybe a 6. Dressed in my “field clothes,” I might become a 7.5 or an 8. I’ve been fucking girls who are 7s-8.5s by my scale. If I can do it, you can do it!

Oh… and one more thing… the most crucial…

IF YOU WANT A QUICK LAY, DO NOT SET OFF THE DAMNED BOYFRIEND SCREENING PROCESS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I wish I’d known this years ago. I used to spend so much time trying to show a girl what a great, awesome, high value, caring guy I was. All that does is get her screening you as a potential boyfriend. THIS DRAMATICALLY COMPLICATES THE HOOKUP PROCESS AND WILL PROBABLY KEEP YOU FROM GETTING LAID!

Girls are the same as men in that they enjoy sex for sex’s sake. Maybe she just broke up with a longtime bf and wants to make sure she’s still attractive to other guys. Maybe she’s just horny and wants a quick fuck to soothe her aching vagina. Whatever.

I’ve noticed that the women I’ve been pulling for SNLs could give a fuck about me, my life, or my dreams for the future. They… just… don’t… care. If she’s going to fuck a guy within a couple hours of meeting him, she doesn’t want to worry about possible emotional entanglements.

Bringing those things into the situation just suggests that you’re going to be hounding her for a commitment. That’s going to cause her to view you in a completely different light. Does she like your personality enough to date you? Do you have enough common interests to make it work? What about your career, or your family, or your philosophies on life, etc.? What if she just plain does not want a boyfriend and is going through a whorish phase?

For a quick SNL, this is much simpler: Is she horny? Are you presenting yourself as a walking sex toy for the evening? OK, then! That’s all she needs to know.

If she does start asking the questions about your life, just answer truthfully and move on. Instead of dwelling on those mundane things, focus on having fun in the moment and on setting up opportunities to kino and either get rejected (and save yourself time) or hook up and get laid.

I want to make it clear that I’m not saying to be rude or run some cutesy pattern to disqualify yourself as bf material if she starts asking these things–IME, that’s suicide.

I’m just saying to be pleasant, be sincere, enjoy yourself, express your interest in her sexually, and create nonverbal opportunities to escalate that don’t feel forced. Hold the seductive EC. Get close and give yourself opportunities for kino. Caress her hand (60 is a GENIUS for pointing these simple tactics out).

There’s a time and place for relationships and boyfriend screening, of course. Personally, I value a good relationship far above any quick bar fling. But sometimes you just wanna get laid with some hot little girl at the club. This has been working for me to achieve that. I think it can help other guys, too.

Another thing to remember: you’re much, much, much more likely to be able to turn a SNL into a relationship after you’ve fucked a girl than to pass the annoying boyfriend screening process and get a lay of any kind, even after 2-3 days. The criteria for a no-strings fuck are just that much lower.

Bravo to fat-hairy-manboob PUAs who are taggin-n-baggin dem ladies!  A lot of IAmMaximus’s stuff isn’t complicated, its mostly an attitude based natural game style with a healthy dose of logistical mastery and physical escalation.  At the end of the day, the only thing that matters is if you’re getting what you want, right?  Well, it seems like IAmMaximus is getting plenty, so why can’t you? 

Plenty Of Fish Profile Strategy To Attract Hot Young Women

JohnnyC69 has a great post over on the mASF forum about his strategy for creating profiles on Plenty Of Fish that attract hot girls.  It’s a pretty interesting breakdown of how he structures his profile, and anyone who is interested in online dating should check it out.

JohnnyC69 writes:

So the other week, I decided to delete my POF and OKC profiles. I was telling myself that I was spending too much time online and that I need to be getting out and honing my cold approach skills.

Problem is, I’m waiting to start a new job right now and until I do, I’m broke and jobless. Temporary problem with the solution already resolved, but fact is, I’m stuck at home waiting and waiting and waiting.

Hell, even if I wanted to make a trip out to wal-mart just to chat up girls, I don’t have the gas in my car to do it!

So after about a week and a half of getting no action to speak of, I got bored and decided to try out a new type of profile. It still utilizes the screening approach I had before, but thanks to some tips from Regal (actually I copy/pasted his and made some minor variations…what? half the ideas were mine anyway!), it’s now really geared toward young hot women, which, around here, it seems the only true hot ones are aged 18-23. After that age, you start getting into the single moms, jaded biatches, etc.

I WILL NOT post the profile on here. After looking on PAIR and seeing how many local guys there are on here (you fucking lurkers! speak up for chrissake!), I can see it getting abused too easily.

I’ll give you the formula though:

Talk about yourself in a C/F manner in the beginning, i.e: “Me? What do I do? I kick ass and take names!” etc…it should be obvious that you’re playing around in an over the top, funny (but still cocky) way.

Next paragraph, tell her how amazing you expect her to be. Then go over the top funny in the descriptions of how she should be amazing. Be creative. In fact, feel free to brainstorm on ways we can make new templates from this model, I’d love to hear what you guys can come up with. I’m talking to you, Mankite.

So that was about it for the profile. I did decided to do something that I’ve never been a fan of, but so far has proven to be doing me some good: I lied about my age.

And why the hell not? 18-23 year olds discriminate against guys in their 30′s. And yeah, I can already hear Blackdragon getting ready to come in and breath fire and acid all over me for having a “limiting belief.” However, it’s just been MY experience.

So this time when I filled it out, I shaved a good 7 years off of my actual age. Another thing about that: I DON’T FUCKING LOOK MY AGE. If the lie was more congruent to the reality, then I don’t see a problem.

At any rate, it’s working. The strategy was to swoop in and find some young, impulsive girls looking to be hot and impulsive with an “older” guy…but not too much older. For some reason, a hot 25 year old guy seems to fit the bill for most of them perfectly.

Supposed to be going over to a hot 18 year old black chick’s house this afternoon. She sent me her number yesterday in response to my opening message. Did a little phone sexing last night. She invited me to come to her house today.

“I don’t have gas money”
“I do.”
“Well alright then, I guess I’ll see you tomorrow…”

Young and impulsive indeed…

Some good stuff here.  Also, having a good picture for your profile will help.  If you’re going to put up pics, I recommend just putting up 1 really good pic.  If you want to play coy, or you don’t think you’re that good looking, you can refrain from having a pic and put in your profile that you will send pics upon request.  That’s worked real well for me in the past.

Troubles Being Social – For Beginners

Naistehirm writes:
Hey,

okay, I have a problem that I have no idea how to get over, I think I have tried several different methods, but none does the work for me.

Anyway, my prob is that most of the time I’m way too dull and not very talkative. I feel like I have never something to say and my mind seems to be pretty empty all the times, or full of crap like I’m thinking why do I not have anything to say.

I party a lot, but most of the time only cause I force myself to go to parties and be social, but that’s not good since in those cases I absolutely don’t enjoy myself.

Especially when I’m sober I have no clue what to talk about. Normally I am in social circles so my chances of getting girls are by social circle, but I have problems attracting girls when I have no idea what to tell them/or what to speak about, nothing comes to my mind, not even any random shit. Sometimes I’m able to hold conversation for few mins, but out of there it just gets dull and I make an excuse to get out of conversation or sometimes I just ignore people cause I don’t have a clue how to answer their questions or whatever. It’s not that I overthink my answers, it’s just that I feel there’s nothing to say. And this makes me feel very uncomfortable in social situations.

And I go out pretty much every day and I haven’t gotten any better. I haven’t got laid for 1.5 years (and I have really got laid for just once, and it wasn’t very enjoyable, was drunk and didn’t get the girl wet so it wasn’t cool at all).
And cause of me not getting girls and all my friends being succesful it hits my self esteem pretty bad, although it’s not that bad, cause I’m still thinking kind of realistically, and my looks aren’t bad either, so all I’m worried about is that I have nothing to say.

I only feel comfortable in social situations when I have had few beers, but then it lasts for just a while and sometimes it just makes me depressed so I can’t just focus on alcohol, and it would be a lot better if I was able to stay social even when I was sober.

Approaching girls is not a big problem for me, out of my friends I think I seem to be more couraegous about this part, but whenever I approach I can only hold conversation for a little while and then I start feeling uncomfortable cause I can’t move things anywhere.

Most of the discussion my friends do is cocky/funny type of, which seems to work on girls very well, but I rarely manage to do that, and even when I’m able to, then I have been silent for a way too long time and then it can come out either lame or mean or whatever.

Seeing my friends being succesful and me not getting any at all, makes me pretty depressed at times and I really want to get over it, cause atm I feel like I’m never going to get girls or even a relationship.

I feel pretty uncomfortable on 1 on 1 situations too, especially when with girls, because I feel like I’m forced to say something but nothing comes to my mind, not even any random stuff. I only feel comfortable with my guy friends cause then I don’t have to talk so much, so it doesn’t affect anything. But yeah, maybe someone can show me the right direction, what to do or whatever…

Thank you.

Questions About Online Game

EricTheViking over at mASF had some interesting questions about online dating I thought I’d address:

EricTheViking writes:

1. Why is it that I have much more success if I use the photos of some good looking guy on my profile? I thought looks don’t matter but if I looked like that guy I could have sex with a new 9 every week.

2. Why is it that you guys don’t use Facebook to find girls? Why dating sites»? I have tons of hotties on Facebook (literally hundreds), so could you, why use dating sites»? I’m really interested in an answer to this question.

Let’s answer these questions in turn… Read more

Comfort Building Routine

Eponymous has a great post about how to build comfort with a pretty solid routine in a post over at mASF.

Eponymous writes:

There don’t seem to be very many comfort routines in the community, even though I’ve heard a lot of big names declare that “the game is played in comfort”. This is a great routine that anyone should be able to use, and it is automatically rooted/personalized, since you’re using your own parents as an example.

Summary: You tell the girl how your parents (or grandparents) met and got married, emphasizing differences in the story each parent tells you. A good lead in is “I asked my parents how they met the other day and…”

script_: I won’t share my parents’ story, which is awesome but not congruent for other people, so here is how you get your own parents to open up (this routine can work with grandparents as well, so you have potentially three different couples to choose from).

All you have to do is ask your mother and father, separately, how they met. Press them for as many details as you can: what were the first words they said to each other, where did they go for their first few dates, was it love at first sight or did it evolve over time, were there any other boys/girls in the picture, etc. You’d be surprised how much your parents will remember.

Now the key thing here is to do this separately, because very often you will get different perspectives or even two completely different takes on the same set of events. In my case, my father left out some very juicy details that my mom later told me. These kinds of inconsistencies make the routine way more interesting for girls.

From here you can take the conversation in a number of interesting directions: male-female interactions, how her parents met, the show How I Met Your Mother, etc.

Calibration: Emphasize certain aspects of the story over others, depending on what you want to convey to the woman. In my case, it turns out my dad was basically a player who finally chose to settle down with my mom, so that kind of story sends really good signals about pre-selection and brain-hijacking (credit: MM) to the girl.

Building comfort is SO important.  It’s nice to have a good routine like this to fall back on.

Stuart Smiley was Full of Shit

**Reposted from the first Lair, original date: 12/22/03

I want to talk about something that has been a part of the seduction community since Ross Jeffries recorded two little cassette tapes in someone’s garage back in ’97. Its something that is an evil, dirty, foul little beast which in my opinion has no business being ANYWHERE near the people who are actually trying to get good at this stuff. So what am I speaking of? Simple. I am speaking of:

Affirmations.

The reason I speak of this is because there is a topic on mASF that caught my eye. Here it is:

Topic: Affirmations (1 of 8), Read 343 times
Conf: >> General
From: 7
Date: Sunday, December 21, 2003 08:35 AM

I have a few questions about affirmations.

Do you use them and do they work for you?

When do you say them and for how long?

I have noticed that they stop working if I stop using them so do I have to keep doing them constantly or will the changes ever become permanent?

Someone suggested recording the affirmations to cd or cassette. Anyone noticed if listening to them has the same effect as saying them?

Would subliminal recordings be more effective? Anyone here know how to make subliminals?

Here is something for you to test. Last night I tried a new affirmation and I got approached twice. That rarely ever happens so it must have been the affirmation.

Here is the affirmation:

“All women get horny when they see me”

You can find the whole thread at:

http://www.fastseduction.com/discussion/read?120655,8

But the reason I bring this up is because I believe that AFFIRMATIONS DO NOT WORK!!!!!

Period. End of story.

The days of Stuart Smiley looking into the mirror chanting “I’m good enough, I’m smart enough, and dog gonnit, people like me!” are over. In fact, I’d argue they were never really here to begin with.

Affirmations are for insecure people who desperately want any way to validate themselves, to the point where they will start trying to brainwash themselves into believing their insecurities do not exist. This is bullshit. There is no way to get past such insecurities unless you face them honestly and work to find their root cause. Not until you do that will these insecurities go away.

How do I know this? Because I’ve been there. I’ve done the affirmations, and I can tell you beyond a shadow of a doubt THEY DO NOT WORK.

I can remember back when I was a full fledged member of the Speed-Seduction cult when I was in college, I went ahead and bought the “Unstoppable Confidence” tapes, mainly due to the recommendation of Bishop (who ended up being a con man, go figure). I’d listen to those suckers every day. In the morning when I got up, on my walks to class, and even at night as I was falling asleep. I’d do the visualizations exactly as I was told.

Did it work? Well, no, not really. It didn’t make me feel any different. I was still insecure and scared, and no more confident than I was before. But I so WANTED them to work, that I convinced myself that they WERE working. So I’d go out and act all confident and full of power with my 50-foot tall self ready to crush anything that steped inside my circle of power that was created with my imaginary Green Lantern ring.

The thing is, it was all an illusion. Its okay to “fake it before you make it” in certain respects. But not when it comes to confidence. The thing about confidence is that no matter how well you fake it, something will happen to SHATTER that illusion for you, and it will affect all your actions because of that.

For instance, when I was doing the “Unstoppable Confidence” tapes in college, I’d start walking up to girls and sarging them, running the IC pattern, Blow-Job, Discovery Channel, etc. Most of the time it would go well, but occasionally I’d get a girl who’d say “Why are you talking to me?” “Who are you?” “Go away!” or some combination of the three. At that point, my “confidence” would be SHATTERED. I’d feel like a tool, a fake, a phoney. It ended up hurting me more than helping me BECAUSE I tried to cover up the real problem instead of facing it.

So to the guys out there wanting to do affirmations, I say DON’T DO IT! They may be a short-term fix for some, but long term they do not work! I would recommend that you take an honest look at yourself and try to determine what it is that makes you feel unconfidant, sad, unhappy, scared, whatever. Take a good hard look and figure out what’s causing it, and then FACE THAT. Do not hide from it.

The goal of all Pick-Up Artists or Seducers should be to become a single, congruent entity, and you cannot do that if you’re sweeping your problems under the rug. You gotta face them. Period.

/end rant

Thundercat

Feminator Returns

**Reposted from the first Lair, original date: 12/22/03

We all have our favorite loonies that post on mASF.  I know Tyler is fond of one dude in particular, and Stevie PUA has his personal fav.  Mine is FEMINATOR.  His massive need for qualification and aspirations for guru-hood in a community that accounts for less than 0.0000000001% of the population is nothing short of entertaining.  Recently, he took a bit of a powder after his last $$$$$$ post broke the camel’s back and caused a number of flames pointed his way (I mean honestly, the signal to noise ratio was just too high).  Anyway, his absence was noticed, leading to posts such as this one by zane:

Topic: Where did FERMINATOR go? (1 of 1), Read 131 times
Conf: >> General
From: zane
Date: Monday, December 22, 2003 12:25 PM

WTF happened to all that MONEY shit from Ferminator???

IS he still ,alive??

But apparently, he spoke too soon, because FEMINATOR is back, with a vengeance.  Here’s his latest $$$$$$$ post for your enjoyment:

Topic: FEMINATOR IS BACK! MALL’S ARE MONEY (1 of 13), Read 417 times
Conf: >> General
From: feminator 15081978@bluewin.ch
Date: Sunday, December 21, 2003 05:45 PM

After clubbing a lot for many years i realized, that clubs are not a good place for meeting top quality women, because they have always the whole defense up.

-Bitch shields (because they expect it)
-Anti slut defense (because of other people, they know)
-Girlfriends (girlscode, drag away)
-AMOGS and BF

Other important facts are …

-Bad chick ratio
-Not every chick goes to the clubs.
-Too many man
-Drugs, alcohol etc.
-Drinks and clubs are not cheap
-Loud music
-At fuck close time, it’s often already 4-6 AM
-Chicks are sometimes also tired in clubs and therefore you can’t game them, especially on Friday.

I also realized, that in clubs are not a lot of possibilities to do interesting things, except sarging.

For somebody, who doesn’t drink, smoke, take drugs or dance, the clubs are a boring place…

Sarging remains the only reason for going to clubs…

Of course it’s possible to game them in clubs, but i found a far better place to find much more and better chicks.

*****************************************************
**********The shopping malls are $$$**********************
*****************************************************

-Good chick ratio. Every chick goes to the malls…

-Chicks are often isolated in shopping malls, therefore no bitch shields or ASD.

-Chicks are not tired and easier to game

-Fuck close time is normally after 8 PM, when the malls close here in Zurich, instead of 4 – 6 AM, so i have more time for good sex.

-Often no negative girlscode.

-Very likely no BF or AMOGS.

-Good insta date possibilities like …
… Shopping together

Then when the malls close at 8 PM …
… Cinema is at 8.30 PM
… After work parties from 7 PM
… Lunch or dinner

My latest opener …

… I prepared a paper bag in a way, i can open the bottom and everything falls on the floor. Haha, they always help me to collect all the things.

… I also prepared a suitcase in the same way. I often put pictures of my hottest GF. When they help me collecting the picture, i tell them the story about my Ex-Girlfriend, who went to London for modelling … Hahah, they always help me to collect the pictures.

… I also create instant accident with cans, clothes etc.
For example I prepare a can tower in a way, that all the cans fall on the floor, when the HB passes. Then she feels guilty. Of course i help her then. (Not field tested)

I create a small accident with some cans and boxes. They always help me to collect the cans. (Field tested)

Then i tell them:”Do you believe in the destiny?”
HB:”Bla bla.”
FEM:”If you look back in 2 years to this day, you will realize, that just of a couple of cans, you whole live changed. My name is Feminator from ASF ”

I do a lot of opinion opener …

“Hey HB (‘s) i need a quick female opinion ….

It opens always. Often i add, that the saleswomen are bad girls, because they lie… Then i tell them a funny story about a really bad saleswomen. Or i ask them, if they are a saleswomen. If they say no, i say:”Very good, because i need a neutral female opinion…”

Or can you help me opener …

“Hey HB i need your help …”

“Do you know, where …”

On the shopping mall insta date, i have always a lot of fun. For example, we check out new clothes together. Then venue change to another mall (Foot in the door principle, are you adventurous enough, then cinema or bar)

In busy times i sarge the customers. In quiet times i sarge the saleswomen, which i use also next time, when it’s busy for social proof.

PS: WHEN WILL BE THE RELEASE OF TFM 2.0 ???????????????? I heard in an old post from PORNHANDLE 25.12.03.
****************************************************

If you want to read the whole thread, it can be found at:

http://www.fastseduction.com/discussion/read?120723,8

The thing I find funny about the above post that poor old FEM doesn’t seem to get — in fact, a lot of people don’t seem to get this — is that you should not be going out in the world with the specific intent to “Pick-Up.”  That’s lame.  That’s one of the reasons I laugh at SS nowadays.  Who wants to go to a coffee shop/grocery store/yoga class or whatever just to meet women?  I find that incredibly stupid.

If I’m going to a coffee shop, its to get coffee.  If I go to a grocery store, its to get groceries.  If I’m going to a yoga class (which I would never do) its to learn yoga.  And if I go to a mall, its to shop.  Any sarging to be done is strictly Targets of Opportunities.  As far as bars/clubs go, I do not SPECIFICALLY go out to bars and clubs to sarge.  I go there to have fun, and to me, part of the fun is trying to pick-up chicks — being social.

This realization came upon me when I was in Chicago and got to see Zan, Craig, and Maddash out on the town.  These guys did not go to these bars to “sarge” or “pick-up.”  They went out there to hang out together, get drunk, and have fun.  The by-product of that was picking-up on chicks.  When I have gone out and just been social, (i.e. drinking, dancing, talking, laughing, ball-busting — what have you) I have been SO MUCH MORE successful than going out with the SPECIFIC intent to sarge.

That’s something guys who are new at this don’t quite have an understanding of yet.  A lot of this comes from “inner game.”  It’s that bit about being “desire-less.”  Not wanting what you really want.  Its fucked-up, yes, but in a way its necessary to feel that way if you want to get REALLY good at it.  Its almost like saying “Just be yourself.”  The trick is, you have to first BECOME the kind of person who naturally does this, and THAT is the hard part.  That is what no in-field workshop or phone consultation or hypnosis will teach you.

I’ve spent 4 years working on my inner game, and I’m just now feeling that its at the point where I’m actually starting to change.  4 YEARS, fellas.  I’ve had to wade through a lot of deep psychological shit to get to where I am now.  We’re talking things that would have made Freud ditch coke for heroine, its so fucked-up.  But it all works out.

I’ll probably talk about this more in an article I plan on writing on Inner Game.  The more people I meet who are genuinely good at this, the more I realize it has to do with inner game and where you’re coming from.  So many people just want the next new “trick” or “method” or whatever.  Look at this Feminator guy for crying out loud.  He’s all about the gimmicks, the tricks, the routines, etc.  What he fails to understand is that all that stuff springs forth from your inner self.  I’ve seen some guys who have TONS of shit memorized, and they can do a pick-up quite well, but when it comes to Day 2, or Day 3, or even RELATIONSHIPS, they lose the chick, because they run out of material.  They don’t have their inner game congruent with their outter game.

Enough rambling.  I’ll post my inner game article here when I get done with it.

Thundercat

PS:  Just remembered, I should probably thank Swinggcat for a lot of this.  He’s very much into the whole “inner game” thing and it has been the subject of many conversations I’ve had with him.  In fact, it probably wouldn’t be on my mind as much if it wasn’t for him, even though I’ve been very much into it since my return from Las Vegas.  Maybe he’ll do something on it in an upcoming newsletter which will blow anything I write on it out of the water.  =)

New Retard on mASF

**Reposted from the first Lair, original date: 12/20/03

Yes, it would appear there is a NEW retard to add to the list of mASF goofballs.  First there was Ray Gordon, then there was Gunwitch, then the infamous Mmasters, and now ladies and gentlemen, I present to you — 24 HRS!

Apparently he stirred up some drama on mASF by posting private emails from Tyler and Papa concerning how many girls each one has laid.  Obviously, this is best summed up by ijjjji’s reply, which was simply:

“Drama queen! Eat shit and die!”

So if you’re interested in reading the latest drama on mASF, the link is:

http://www.fastseduction.com/discussion/read?120377,8

Thundercat

Harmless, Movin’ on up to the *SOUTH* Side

**Reposted from the first Lair, original date: 12/20/03

Hey all,

New-kid-guru-on-the-block Harmless has just announced his arrival in Austin Texas on mASF. I know he plans on starting up his seduction business soon and is looking to start teaching workshops in the coming months, which should present a nice alternative to the Tyler/Papa Real Social Dynamics workshops which are going to go up in price soon.

Thundercat

Topic: In Austin Now (1 of 3), Read 159 times
Conf: >> General
From: Harmless reinhen27@yahoo.com
Date: Friday, December 19, 2003 11:50 AM

Yo.

I made it to Austin. Alive. In ONE night. 17 hours. I’m sore, tired and cranky. BUT… It’s time to teach these Austin ho’s who their daddy is. Don’t worry, my pimp hand is WAY strong.

Anyone who wants to come up to Austin to sarge with me, let me know. I should point out that I’m going to be VERY poor for the first month or so, but it’s still on.
–

Harmless
harmless@reenhanced.com

The Power of the Dark Side — mASF and Shredded Souls

**Reposted from the first Lair, original date: 12/18/03

I found a post on mASF entitled “The aftermath of mASF and her shredded soul.” The post was just the right amount of melodrama to capture my interest, so I decided to check it out. It was put up by a guy called Acolyte and goes as follows:

Topic:
The aftermath of mASF and her shredded soul. (1 of 17), Read 562 times
Conf: >> General
From: arby_acolyte ratty1@webmail.co.za
Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2003 03:19 AM

I hurt a girl today. Her heart is shattered into a million pieces.

Because of me. Entirely. And I have no excuse.

Does this feel good? No.

The stuff on this site is powerful. Very little is mentioned here on the emotional effect we’re having on our targets – sure, we’re creating and amping attraction etc…. ..but no thought is given to the resulting ATTACHMENT that our ‘targets’ begin to feel.

Guys, for the sake of your Karma (if you believe in that kinda thing), use this info wisely. Its not a toy.

I understand how/why she feels as she does and, if she doesn’t commit suicide, she’ll recover… ..and heed this: She’s NOT a psycho, just regular LSE.

Such is the power we have on mASF.

Acolyte.
PS. I’ve taken this girl under my wing and I intend to help her regain her feet. I intend to do what I can to raise her Self-Esteem. Please wish her luck.

______________________________
peripheral vision is often overrated

Now, this post is interesting because I am very much conflicted as to how I feel about it. On one side, I empathise with the guy. On the other hand, I can see where all the posters who are responding to him are coming from.

The thing that is easy to forget on the internet is that these girls are real people. When you read about them in cold words on your computer screen and imagine the generic woman in your head, its easy to be neutral in your assessment of where this guy went wrong and why he shouldn’t be feeling the way he does. The thing is, this girl is very real for this Acolyte guy. She’s probably someone he slept with, someone he shared something with, and someone he probably connected with on some level. And he ended up breaking her heart. Its funny, because the subculture we exist in with the studying of PUA is not very conducive to looking at women as real people, rather, they become objects of our desires and conquests. An example of this is Ellyn, who I mentioned in the post earlier. I shared a part of my life with that chick, and even though I do talk shit about her, when I was on the phone, the last thing I wanted to do was hurt her feelings, because I could HEAR the genuine emotion in her voice that she was happy to hear from me.

I think that’s the crux of the issue there. Emotion is the stongest frame there is, and it overrides all logic. That’s one of the reasons chicks are so powerful. They run on emotion, they are able to manifest it faster and more powerfully than most men can think of, and when they do, us men are swept right along into their frame (well, unless you’re jlaix, but he’s in a league all his own =)

I personally do not think its AFC for him to feel bad that this girl got hurt. But the posters in the thread are right, even if they are a bit crass in their advice. This is a natural chick response to recapture the relationship frame, by guilting the guy into helping her overcome her emotion. If this Acolyte dude persists in trying to help her get over him, she’s gonna suck him back into her reality, and eventually hurt him the way she was hurt just to salvage some of her self-esteem. I don’t think she’d do it consciously or maliciously, but I do think its very likely to go down that way. So he’s damned if he does, and damned if he doesn’t, as far as this girl is concerned.

Which brings us to an interesting moral quandary: How do you act with girls, enjoy tehir company, and protect yourself all at the same time? Do you allow yourself to become attacted and run the risk of being manipulated? Or do you keep yourself detached and never really enjoy a substancial relationship?

I prefer to look at pick-up in very Machiavellian terms. If none of you have ever read Machiavelli, I suggest picking up his book “The Prince.” Its quite a brilliant book on politics, leadership, and persuasion. (I happen to believe Machiavelli has been reincarnated as Swinggcat, but that’s another post all together =) Anyhow, the thing about Machiavelli is that he is completely amoral. His advice is designed to get you results, not make judgements about right or wrong. Whether you use the information for good or evil, that is up to the individual.

In terms of PUA, I rate my success on my happiness at the time. If I’m doing shit with a girl and I’m happy, then I’m successful. If I’m involved with a girl and I’m miserable and paranoid and insecure, I am definitely not doing something right. So I think the trick is to create a reality that is so strong that your happiness exists regardless of who you’re with, and you allow the girls you date to take part in that happiness. I base this on Zan’s philosophy. Here’s a guy who’s 9 girlfriends and ex-wife just threw him a lingerie party for his 40th birthday, and they all know each other and do not get catty or jealous. How is this possible? Simple. He never destroys that sense of beauty that is around him. That sense of happiness, that frame that he creates that sucks people in. Its always there, and it diffuses any negativity that exists around him.

The bhuddist believe that to attain enlightenment, you must kill all desire. I think to get good at PUA, and I’m talking master level here, you really do have to kill all desire when it comes to women. But at the same time, you still have to CARE for the women, otherwise you end up hurting them. I guess I’m saying you have to be desire-less but care-full (pun intended).

Its a fine line for sure, and I’m not quite sure how to attain it yet. But its something for me to think about. I hope this rant made some sort of sense. If anyone has any thoughts on this or how to go about doing this, I’d love to hear them.

Thundercat