The Top 10 Pick-Up Artists Of 2003
February 4, 2004 by Thundercat
Filed under Analysis, Top 10 Lists
**Reposted from the first Lair, original date: 12/16/03
Okay, so the debate has been raging for a while now over who is the best PUA (Pick-Up Artist) out there. Obviously, a lot of egos are involved in this statement, and everyone has their own opinions about who the best really is. In fact, its so subjective, that I don’t really think there will ever be a clear and honest answer on the subject. Its like asking who the best warrior or soldier is in a war. But the fact of the matter remains, no one can ever ALWAYS be the best. They’re always going to have their off days — be a little bit slow, a little bit late, a little bit unprepared or caught off guard. But that doesn’t stop some people from categorizing the people in our little community as “The Best.” So I’ve decided to throw my hat in the ring and rate the top 10 PUAs operating out there.
However, only the people I have met personally are eligible for my list. There could very well be many great PUAs out there that beat these guys out, but I have not met them and cannot verify their skills personally, so they are off my list for now, though I will mention a few afterwards who I think are worthy of it. Also, my rankings are not based on sheer skill alone, rather, they are based on consistency, and what I have seen as far as how often they are practicing what they preach. So keep that in mind as we go through this.
Thundercat’s Top 10 Pick-Up Artist
1. Style: Style is definitely, hands down, bar none, the best operating in the game today. This guy is probably the most evil, sneaky, manipulative bastard I have ever seen in operation. The thing is, this guy comes in totally under the radar, and that is why he is so dangerous. His subtlety is so amazing, that before you know it, you are qualifying yourself to him and he has you right where he wants you. And the thing is, he does it with both girls AND guys. No one is safe. To give you an idea of how incredible Style is, he’s practically invented most of the techniques a lot of the top guys, like Mystery and Tyler Durden, are using and teaching. He is practically Machiavellian in nature, and is someone I both admire and fear. I should also point out that I have a special, non-gay, place in my heart for this man, because it was with his help that I broke down my barrier with approaching women, so I owe a lot of my current game and success to Style, which is another reason why I rate him #1.
2. Swinggcat: Swinggcat comes in at a close second, and would in fact probably be number one if it weren’t for the fact that that he is a better looking guy than Style. Swinggcat is a pretty hip looking (think a shorter version of Vince Vaughn in Swingers and you get a rough idea of what Swinggcat looks like), whereas Style is a skinny, bald, jewish guy. Swinggcat is just as evil, sneaky, and manipulative, but considering what Style has to overcome in the looks department, that puts his game above Swingg’s. That said, I have seen Swinggcat in action on numerous occasions and am amazed at a lot of his game. The way he is able to process and sum up the information girls give him and turn their frame around is truly a sight to see. Not only that, he is so intuative, he can make up cold readings on the fly and be almost 100% accurate, which is fuckin’ creepy. His book only scratches the surface of his vast knowledge, and I think we’ll be getting a lot of good (and evil) stuff from his upcoming newsletters.
3. Zan: Zan is not a name that is very well known in the community, but having met the guy and seen him in action, I am convinced he is one of the top dudes out there when it comes to picking up chicks. In fact, I’d have even placed him at number 1 if it wasn’t for the fact that this guy is a “natural” seducer, and therefore what he does cannot be taught to others. But in accordance with the sheer skill of his game, he lays all others flat on their back. The thing is, the guy looks like a male model. He’s 40 years old, but looks like he’s 20. He actually USED to be a model, in fact, back in France in the 80′s I think, and his girlfriend was Monica Bellucci of the Matrix fame (hey, don’t hate the player, hate the game =). Currently, the guy has between 6 and 9 hot ass girlfriends who ALL know about each other, and apparently he enjoys many 3-somes and fuck buddies to boot. Not only that, but Zan has one of the most amazing philosophies on life I have ever heard. He spends his time moving towards beauty and away from things that are not beautiful. I hung out with the guy for only 3 days, but I am secure enough in my masculinity to say that if I was a chick, I’d have been all over him. Probably the coolest guy in the community. He was on stage at the Chicago DYD seminar, and if David DeAngelo ever decides to sell the audio to that thing, you’ll get a real treat hearing Zan speak about inner game. Simply amazing.
4. Maddash: Maddash, like Zan, is also a successful, good looking, older guy. He’s a big proponant of the “No Game” game, which is pretty much emulating the behaviors of “naturals,” such as Zan, and because of that, Maddash’s game comes off as very subtle and natural. When I saw him in action I was very impressed. It seems like he gets a new girl every night. The thing about Maddash is that his life is not ruled by PUA, he is very much into business and athletics as well. Pick-up is just a small factor of his life, but one he strives to perfect — and boy, does he do a good job at it.
5. Craig: Craig probably deserves to be higher on the list, but unfortuneately, I think the four people above him beat him as far as technique goes. That said, Craig is VERY good. He is the king of the short-set method. This is basically where you approach a set of women, say something funny/amusing, then move onto the next set and repeat. Its a very good way of being social and works great in bar scenes. Its also good for creating social proof. Craig is also a very funny guy, and his dancing skills help attract attention from others (in a good way, mind you). The quality of women Craig gets is quite high. I have yet to see him with a girl I would rank lower than a 9 on the looks scale. Not only that, but he seems to get them pretty consistantly. However, the fact that he comes off as a good looking frat guy, the fact that he has appeared on Elimidate, and the fact that he lives on a beach, are all contributing factors to his success — but that does not take away from the fact that he is very skilled. He is also one of the few PUAs I’ve seen that can do all his shit effectively while drunk. He was also on stage at the Chicago DYD seminar, so you may hear stuff from him fairly soon.
6. Mystery: Okay, I know Mystery is gonna be pissed that I rank him so low (or not. He probably doesn’t give a shit what I think. Can ya blame him?), but in my opinion, for as good as Mystery is, the other 5 guys are better. The thing about Mystery is that he’s incredibly good at raising his value in other’s eyes. I’ve seen him pull off some amazing instances of social proof with his magic tricks, and he is incredibly entertaining, funny, and exciting. Its easy to get caught up in Mystery’s spell. That said, the reason I rate him #6 is because I do not feel his long game is very good. I always get the sense that Mystery has a hard time genuinely connecting with people, and this effects his long term relationships. It seems like he can be very insecure at times and needs constant validation from others, which leads to a lot of mind games that get him his validation, but at the same time succeeds in pushing people away from him. Whether or not this is intentional, I don’t know, but it happens. He also seems to care more about adjusting his game to suit the girl than making the girl adjust to his game, which I think ends up hurting his pick-up in the long run because it is not really congruent with who he is and how he presents himself long term. In fact, if you hang out with Mystery long enough, you get the sense that everything he talks to you about is a pattern, and he always ends up bringing the conversation back to his favorite topic, which is, of course, himself. And that is the reason I put him at #6.
7. Tyler Durden: Tyler is one of the big “up and comers” in the community. His posts made him a legend on ASF, and then once he teamed up with Papa and started doing workshops, his stock only rose. For a while, there was speculation as to whether or not TD was all talk, but he proved to everybody that he was legit in the Vegas Mystery Method workshop where he not only got laid, but got Style and Mystery laid as well. I have seen Tyler at work in the field, and he is impressive. He is a genuinely funny and engaging guy with lots of interesting stuff to talk about. His posts are some of the most interesting to read in the community as well, and he backs up his teachings with lots of field experience. However, like Mystery, I get the sense that TD has problems in his long game. When he picks chicks up, he does so from the frame where he makes the girls feel like “bad girls” or “sluts.” This works good for party girls and good girls alike, but on day two when the frame wears off, the girls associate that feeling with him and then flake, because feeling bad and slutty might be exciting for a night, but long term it is not a good feeling. TD also comes off as very gay. This is not a bad thing per say, but he has adopted the “hot chick” frame so congruently, that I think when girls sleep with him, its almost incongruent with who they thought he was. I could, of course, be totally wrong in this assessment since I haven’t hung out and sarged with Tyler as much as I’d like, but I’m going off of what I have noticed.
8. Primoman: Primoman is a dude that is no longer an active member of the community, but he is still a pick-up artist in every sense of the word. Primoman is known as the “King of the Ugs.” He is a dude who I’ve yet to see without a girl on his arm. Allbeit, that girl is usually ugly, or fat, or a combination of the two, but nonetheless, it is a girl. Primoman is not so much about quality as he is about QUANTITY. He probably lays more girls than any other guy in the community, but he is also not too picky with his prospects. Regardless, he gets laid a LOT! And that’s what it all comes down to in the end. His game is very Juggler in nature. In fact, he is quite AFC in his approach, but he is just so congruent with who he is and gently persistent in his sarge, that he eventually wins the girl over. Lately he’s been working his way up the “looks” scale as far as his girls go, so he may be giving Style a run for his money some day.
9. Sickboy: Sickboy is a protogee of Tyler and Papa. He’s a New Yorker and is best known for his appearance in the movie Zoolander as one of the male models in the movie. Yes, that’s right, the guy looks like a male model. But despite this, he is incredibly down to earth and has absolutely no ego about himself. He’s a very easy guy to talk to and a good friend. His game is also quite solid, though I do think it’s helped greatly by his looks. I think his frames aren’t as strong as they could be, but he definitely has the subtleties of PUA down pat. He recently spoke to the NYC lair and that’s a great read if you can find the transcripts somewhere. He’s a guy to look out for.
10. Harmless: Harmless is not what you would expect from a PUA. He’s pretty prolific on ASF, and seems to know his shit. The thing is, the guy comes off very much as his name describes him — Harmless. He’s a pretty average looking guy who seems very unassuming at first. But then you see the guy in action, and he’s very good. I think he comes across much like Mystery and TD, where he raises his value in the girl’s eyes by being entertaining and engaging. I know I enjoy talking to the guy, if that’s any indication. I haven’t seen enough of his game in action to critique it any further, but I do know he’s going to start teaching workshops soon, so his game’s gotta be pretty high. Regardless, he’s one to keep an eye on.
HONORABLE MENTIONS
There are a number of other people out there who probably deserve to be on this list, but like I said before, I have not had a chance to really see them in action. But here are a few who I think deserve a mention.
Bad Boy — Apparently this guy is amazing. I know TD gets a lot of his AMOG tactics from Bad Boy. He’s a croatian pick-up artist who was injured in the Bosnian war, which makes his game so much more incredible considering he was almost killed and still suffers the effects from that somewhat. Apparently the guy is very fearless and straight-forward agressive with women. In fact, some would descibe his game as all cocky and no funny, which is probably why its so effective. Not only that, but he is supposed to be incredibly congruent. I know he’s currently fucking Miss Croatia and using her as a pawn to pull other women for threesomes if that tells you anything about his game.
Toecutter – I don’t know the guy personally and all I have to go off of are his posts on ASF and Mystery’s Lounge, but this guy seems to have it going on. I know TD studdied his archive like the dead sea scrolls, and his posts convey a very congruent attitude. I’m interested in seeing him in action, and if I’m ever in Canada I’ll see if I can’t hook up with him.
MTLPUA — Don’t know much about him, but I hear he’s really good.
David X — I know Clifford had good things to say about him.
Chet – The Chetinator! I got to see him speak in Chicago. Supposedly he’s god-like with women, but I have yet to see him in action and can’t say for sure.
Adam – The “natural.” Look to see great things from this guy in the future!
Masterclass — The guy is currently juggling 4 girls right now. He’s also an incredibly sneaky speed seducer who is moving more into the cocky/funny stuff and having great success. Right now, I think his game could be up there with the best there is if he got past his fear of approaching.
Rick H. — The legend. I have not hung out with the guy yet, but I’m sure when I do, it’ll be veeeeeeery interesting. =)
Ross Jeffries — I’ve hung out with Ross on a few occasions now and have only sarged with him once. From what I saw, I liked, but have not done enough field work with him to accurately rate the guy. I know Papa speaks highly of him, and he’s been out in the field with him more than I have.
Papa – I go out with Papa all the time, so I’m a bit biased when it comes to his skill level. He teaches at all of TD and Mystery’s workshops as well, and his field reports are always worth a read. He’s also single-handedly bringing this community together, so he has to be respected for that at the very least. The reason I didn’t put him in the top 10 was because much of his material is from Style and Tyler. I think in order to be in the top 10, a PUA needs to be developing his own style. One thing I will say about Papa is that he is incredibly good with creating strong frames.
Alphamale – This guy is incredibly impressive. Most of his game is based on using pivots to pull girls for him. I haven’t hung out with the guy enough to get an idea of how good he is, but from what I have seen, his game is awesome.
Well, there ya go, my Top 10. Hopefully one day I’ll make my list, but I doubt it! I’m much too hard on myself, lol.
That’s why they call me…
Thundercat
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“Дело “Лайф-из-Гуд” — “Гермес” — “Бест Вей”: кооператив выполнял обязательства
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“Мне сказали, что это лучше банка”
Признанный следствием потерпевшим Шахмин — пенсионер МВД. Лично с подсудимыми не знаком, но на презентациях видел.
О “Лайф-из-Гуд”, “Гермесе”, “Бест Вей” узнал из СМИ и интернета. Консультанты Галлямовы из Нефтекамска пригласили вступить. “Бест Вей” и “Гермес” — это как будто одна система, — сообшил Шахмин. — Я согласился вложить деньги в “Гермес”, так как давно знал Галлямовых. Они продали квартиру и с бизнеса вложили деньги туда, они раньше меня там были. Я вложил 2,3 млн рублей, взятые в кредит в Газпромбанке, их передал Галлямовым лично в руки, так как доверял, они говорили, что откроют счет “Виста”. Мне сказали, что это лучше банка и лучше, чем “недвижку” покупать. Если сколько-то людей созываешь, ты получаешь какие-то проценты и еще растешь. Обещали 30% доходности, якобы идет инвестирование акций — криптой, недвижимостью. Деньги высветились в личном кабинете в евро, потом я узнал, что деньги не настоящие, это информационная система, компьютерная цифра, виртуальные деньги”, — рассказал он. При этом подтверждений передачи денег у Шахмина нет, однако Галлямов признал на допросе у следователя, что получил деньги и внес на счет “Виста”.
Свидетель вывел со счета “Виста”, по его словам, 1 тыс. евро и 50 тыс. рублей. Для платежей предлагали “Пей Про”: мол, не надо волноваться, будем выводить деньги, проходи верификацию. Потом у свидетеля появились сомнения, и он заявил, что хочет вывести деньги. Галлямовы, по его словам, начали всячески откладывать вывод, до тех пор, пока ЦБ не включил “Гермес” в предупредительный список.
Когда начались трудности, хотели через систему “Свифт” вывести, через “Тинькофф” — но это не получилось: “Начали они просить, чтобы никто из клиентов не возмущался, начали говорить о регистрации на криптобирже “Бинанс” для дальнейшего вывода денег. Также я там зарегистрировался, но тоже ничего не получилось”.
После этого Шахмин написал заявление в полицию. Всплывшие в ходе судебного заседания три личных кабинета в “Лайф-из-Гуд” и переводы ему на карту объяснить не смог.
Признанная потерпевшей Дорда была только клиентом “Гермеса”. Подсудимых не знает.
“Узнала о компании в 2016 году при переезде из Москвы во Владимир. Рассказали консультанты Адрианова и Волюшко, которые занимались страхованием жизни. Рассказывали и о ПК “Бест Вей”, но мне это было неинтересно. Адрианова знала, что я продала квартиру и денежки у меня есть. Зная это, консультант целенаправленно решила затащить в компанию “Гермес”. И я стала очередной жертвой. Мне сказали, что Андрианова занималась гипнозом. Отношения дружеские были до 2021 года. Андрианова была вхожа в дом, знакома с мужем. Деньги передавала Андриановой. Было открыто три счета” — рассказала Дорда. Признанная потерпевшей утверждает, что деньги ни разу не снимала.
Заявляет ущерб в более 700 тыс. рублей.
Признанная следствием потерпевшей Шайхулина (допрошенная по ВКС с Самарой) — клиент компании “Гермес”. Из подсудимых знает Виктора Ивановича Василенко и Наливана.
“Первый договор с “Гермесом” заключила в 2019 году, второй — в 2021 году. Внесла 1 тыс. евро. Договоры скачивала с кабинета, отдала наличными 70 тыс. руб. В личный кабинет сама заходить могла, но переводить не было возможности. Обещали плавающий процент от 20% в год. Второй счет открыла на 1 тыс. евро. Переводила частным лицам небольшие суммы. Деньги на счету появлялись согласно переводам. Без помощи консультанта Духнова выводить не получалось. “Гермес” свои обязательства исполнял, начисляли проценты, ажио брали. Я сама не вникала, но видела, что каждый месяц начисления были. В кабинет заходила раз в месяц. В последний раз в кабинет заходила накануне заявления в органы. Потом его заблокировали”, — говорит она.
“С официальной претензией в “Гермес” обращалась, в поддержку писала. Ответили, что ведутся работы, скоро откроют. Актов сверки с “Гермесом” нет у меня, в гражданско-правовом порядке за возвратом денег не обращалась, ни с какими юристами не общалась. Наткнулась на канал в интернете — там был совет писать заявление в правоохранительные органы”, — добавляет она.
Заявляет общую сумму ущерба в 2 430 430 руб.: “Я взяла кредит, плачу теперь проценты, поэтому эту сумму процентов хочу получить”. При этом в материалах уголовного дела фигурирует сумма в 1 650 000 руб. ущерба.
Шайхуллина поясняет, что “забыла про 800 тыс., так как мне карту перевели 900 тыс. Духнов сказал: “Они у тебя будут лежать, давай обратно внесем”, и я внесла 850 тыс. где-то. Я только что вспомнила про 800 тыс.”.
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Trump’s call for a protest crackdown has been a boon for Chinese propaganda
Analysis by CNN’s James Griffiths
Protesters running amok. Innocent citizens under siege. Outside actors engaging in terrorist acts. Police struggling to maintain control and in desperate need of reinforcements.
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That was how Chinese state media portrayed anti-government protests in Hong Kong last year, dismissing calls for greater democracy and an investigation into police brutality by focusing on individual acts of violence and property damage.
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Throughout the protests, the US was consistent in its support of people’s right to take to the streets and have their voice heard. Facing widespread unrest and public anger at home in the wake of the death of George Floyd, the reaction from US President Donald Trump appeared markedly different.
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On Monday, Trump called for the military to be deployed to “dominate” protesters, and demanded states do more to stem “acts of domestic terror.”
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The irony has not been lost on Beijing, which on Thursday marks (or rather doesn’t, the date is highly censored) its own military crackdown on anti-government protesters on June 4, 1989.
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“Washington’s promise of equality and justice for all in the country has remained hollow at best,” state news agency Xinhua said in a commentary titled “The coming suffocation of the American dream.”
“Amid the ongoing anti-racism protests in the country, decision-makers in Washington, instead of trying to sooth the pain and anger of the public, have been fanning the flames, calling protesters ‘THUGS,’ and threatening them with ‘the most vicious dogs, and most ominous weapons,” the commentary said.
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China Daily, a state-backed newspaper, noted that “The US, after the killing of Floyd, seems to be on fire, and troops have been mobilized to subdue angry demonstrators.”
“This is certainly not what the world expects to see in a country that is the world’s sole superpower,” it added. “But that sadly is the reality of the US.”
This rhetoric isn’t just embarrassing for Washington, it’s also a sign of how the US may find its influence damaged by a perceived hypocrisy over human rights at home and abroad.
Earlier today, Hong Kong’s leader Carrie Lam pointed to the unrest in the US as evidence of Washington’s “double standards.”
“They attach great importance to the national security of their country, but look at our national security through tinted spectacles, especially the current situation in Hong Kong,” she added.
The ability of Washington to influence Beijing’s position on Hong Kong – which is in part founded on fear of outside influence in the city – was already severely limited. The Trump administration’s reaction to protests at home may have hurt its position even further.
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