Dr. Phil Bitch Slaps Ross Jeffries – Have Video Proof
April 22, 2008 by Thundercat
Filed under Rants & Reviews
Ha ha ha – he he he – hoo hoo hoo…
Ah, where to begin…
First of all – why the hell would any of these guys go on Dr. Phil in the first place? Do you know any GUYS who watch Dr. Phil? (Well, STRAIGHT guys?) I certainly don’t. Dr. Phil’s audience is WOMEN. So why bother wasting time pitching your seduction business to a bunch of chicks if you aren’t teaching them how to get men? Snarf.
Okay, all that aside though – I thought the Mystery Method guys came off very well in this show. They were cool, calm, collected and walked that fine line between being "politically correct" and honest about what they teach. Fact is, Mystery Method DOES work on women. It is effective. That’s why it’s taken off the way it has.
Now, whatever you feel about Savoy and the current state of Mystery Method, post-Mystery, is immaterial to this show. Sure, I would like it if Mystery was still in charge of the Mystery Method name, but that doesn’t mean these guys aren’t offering value to other men by teaching what they are. (Plus, there’s a lot of behind the scenes stuff about the meltdown over at Mystery Method I won’t be sharing here, since I’ve been sworn to secrecy not to reveal it.)
So now that we’ve got Mystery Method out of the way, let’s get to the real mean and potatoes of this.
Ross "MINE’99" Jeffries.
And boy oh boy, was MINE’99 channeling all his evil, selfish, hypocritical energies in this episode! Wow. I knew MINE’99 was delusional, but the extent of his warped reality has only gotten worse with age. Maybe his horrible friz-fro is somehow affecting his brain in the same way an alien parasite would? Who knows.
Anyway, back to the show…
First off MINE’99 proudly proclaims that he is the "father" of the
seduction community. Though he did start the online newsgroups, I want
to officially amend this title to the "mentally-off creepy uncle who
likes to molest you when he gets drunk" of the seduction community,
since that is probably a more accurate statement of his real role in
it’s birth and development.
He says he wants to give men a way to get women without
participating in the four "B"s – Bullying, Begging, Buying, and Booze.
Which doesn’t make any sense since it’s obvious MINE’99 would never get
any female attention without partaking in all of those things he just
mentioned. But regardless, he left out the fifth "B" which is
BULLSHIT. Or maybe not, since Speed Seduction is exactly that.
Moving on…
Then he starts talking about the "Dark Side" of seduction. He goes on to say:
There
are people in this community who are teaching methods and tactics that
I think women should definitely be aware of. There are people who are
teaching some very sick and twisted stuff. And I do sort-of feel like
Dr. Frankenstein, I’ve given birth to a monster. There’s 10,000
bastard children of mine running around and I sort-of feel like its a
responsibility of mine to clean it up. I would like to put them out of
business if I could. Had I not started this, they wouldn’t have been
around.
Honestly, I’m surprised he didn’t finish with "IN 1999!!!!!!" *dum dum duuuuuum!*
Yes, MINE’99′s ego has not diminished along with his looks, age, and
penis size. He has become even MORE egomaniacal as he’s become more
and more irrelevant.
MINE’99 was the FATHER of teaching sick and twisted ways to seduce
women! His entire BUSINESS is based on it! And he acts like he’s the
one who spawned all the lame-ass copy cats.
News Flash: No one is ripping off Speed Seduction because it
SUCKS. If anyone can claim to have a billion bastard kids running
around perverting his teachings for their own gain, it’s MYSTERY since
almost every workshop business in existence is teaching what is
essentially his stuff!
I love how MINE’99 is acting like a crusader wanting to "put people
out of business if he could." Didn’t he try and destroy David DeAngelo
for years? Didn’t he launch a crusade targeting Mystery which ended in
death threats? Has he not tried to shut this very blog down numerous
times by sending me threating BS legal letters?
This is a guy who is SO insecure, he even brings his lawyer with him
to Neil Strauss’s book signings in case anyone bad-mouths him. Ross
still yearns for the good old days when he was the only game in town.
And honestly, if it wasn’t for Neil swooping in and making him part of
his Stylelife business, he’d probably have gone under a while ago
himself.
The fact is: Ross doesn’t GIVE A SHIT about helping other guys or
saving the seduction community from the "rip off artists." He just
hates the competition which has all but sunk his business and forcing
him to go on shows like Dr. Phil to drum up business. He only cares
about his EGO, which is what ultimately drives the man.
Notice how MINE’99 dodges the question when Dr. Phil asks him "How
successful have you been at this from a business standpoint?" Fact is,
last time he was successful was a DECADE ago. His business is all but
treading water at the moment because not only does his stuff suck, but
his former business partner is running a competing business selling the
SAME FREAKIN’ CRAPPY PRODUCTS. But MINE’99 turns it around using his
ninja MindLines skills and says "I’ve certainly been VERY influential."
Yeah, right.
Influential in the respect that you have taught men around the world what NOT to do if they want to get a chick. Obviously.
Next is where the interview gets REALLY good.
So Dr. Phil asks "Have you been on the sleazy side of this, and now
you don’t like the direction its taken?" To which MINE’99 completely
lies through his freakin’ crooked teeth.
"What
disturbs me is that the other schools that have cropped up rely a lot
on invalidation, on making women doubt their attractiveness, on
techniques that make women uncertain of whether they are being
complimented or insulted. They’re digging into people’s LOWEST
emotions – their fears, their insecurities, and I don’t think that’s a
valid way to attract someone AT ALL."
Ah… so
sayeth the man who who created the BLOWJOB PATTERN. This is a guy who
would not only teach people how to anchor bad, evil, feelings of loss
and abandonment to doors to keep women from breaking up with you – but
he would REVEL in it. This is a guy who would share with people how to
hypnotically regress women back to childhood and mess with their sexual
development and identity in order to get laid. This is a guy who
actually ENCOURAGED men to walk up to women and say "My name is Manny
The Martian. What is your favorite flavored bowling ball?"
The whole concept behind Speed Seduction was using hypnosis to
completely take away a woman’s free will and make her do everything you
wanted, which essentially would turn her into a hypno-slave. That’s
the marketing, that’s the concept, that’s what he tries to teach people.
And now here he is badmouthing the very stuff he encouraged for
YEARS, until his "sudden" turn around into a "good guy" last year when
he was desperate to save his business and had to mend some fences.
Lame.
And you know the best part about this interview? It’s when MINE’99
starts getting defensive with Dr. Phil and tries to lecture to the
guy. Now, I’m certainly no fan of Dr. Phil, but ya gotta respect a guy
who smacks down MINE’99s bullshit when he starts shoveling it out.
Then, to make matters better, when Dr. Phil tries to peg him as a
sleazbag by teaching men how to get laid, MINE’99 tries to defend
himself by saying his marketing for his stuff is MISLEADING, and it
doesn’t really help guys get laid.
Ha ha ha ha ha…
He might as well have just said "I gotta lie about my shit because otherwise NO ONE WOULD BUY IT!"
He then goes on to defend his Get Laid newsletter by saying "I wrote
that in 1993!" (Wow, six years before 1999 – guess that stuff sucks
even worse, huh?)
So not only is his stuff misleading and ineffective, it hasn’t been
updated in 15 years. I don’t know about you, but what I was doing to
get chicks 15 years ago has changed dramatically to what works for me
today. Way to stay current Rossy-boy.
Misleading, ineffective, AND outdated. Yay! Don’t you just want to go out and buy Speed Seduction right now???
Then Dr. Phil accuses MINE’99 of being a pimp. Dr. Phil got this
one wrong. People pay Pimps to get laid. People pay Ross to learn how
to stay at home and masturbate more. I’ve seen Hustle & Flow.
That guy was a pimp. You, MINE’99 are certainly no Pimp.
Then Ross goes on the ATTACK. He starts bad mouthing the MM boys by saying:
"There’s
a lot these guys do that they didn’t talk to you about that’s actually
really kind-of nasty. One of the things they rely on doing is flipping
women back and forth between feeling like they are being approved of,
and feeling they are being criticized. They do something called
Push-Pull, where they give the woman a little attention, and they’ll
pull it away so she doubts whether they’re attracted to her or not.
They use a lot of invalidation, the theory being that if you invalidate
a woman, she’ll have sex with you to prove her attractiveness. There’s
a lot of that going on."
At this point, Nick Savoy
says that this isn’t true. And you know what? It’s NOT!!! Swinggcat
(Speed Seductions former top student) was the one who pioneered the
Push-Pull theory. I don’t recall Mystery Method ever using that stuff
- even if they say they do, it’s not true Push-Pull the way it was
initially conceived.
And the humorous thing here is that what Ross describes is something
Speed Seduction teaches – only in a lot less effective way – by using
fractionation and anchoring and submodalities. He is basically
criticizing everything he teaches himself right here! Unreal.
But oh, it gets better…
"What they said about it
not being canned routines is ridiculous. They use huge amounts of
canned routines. When they ask your opinion, they don’t really care.
In fact, they’ll interrupt you when you try and give it and go on to
finish the routine."
Wow, this coming from a guy
whose entire SEDUCTION SYSTEM is about memorizing canned hypnotic
patterns and vomiting them back up with every girl you meet. In order
for Speed Seduction to even be remotely effective, you’ve got to
memorize like 300 of these suckers. And do you honestly think MINE’99
gives a fuck if a girl has ever really watched that roller coaster
documentary on the discovery channel? Do you think he CARES what she
really felt like when she was a little girl discovering her Christmas
presents?
Honestly, this is hypocracy at it’s best.
This is even illustrated further when MINE’99 explains what he
"teaches," and then Dr. Phil says "But that’s not the way you sell it
on your website." To which MINE’99 responds "No, absolutely not."
Let me repeat that in a different way:
MINE’99 DOES NOT ACTUALLY DELIVER WHAT HE PROMISES TO SELL YOU.
He even admits it on national TV.
And then the girls chime in. They even say the Mystery Method guys
are trying to do what Ross says is the "right way" to pick up women,
but that they’re doing it in a "Better Fashion."
Translation: Ross’s shit don’t work. MM’s shit does.
Another girls says it’s creeping her out.
Translation: Ross is creepy. His teachings are creepy. Therefore, she is creeped out.
Then the final girl says she never wants to go to a bar never
again. Someone should warn her that MINE’99 and his students don’t go
to bars, so that’s probably the SAFEST place to be.
And finally – Ross completely DENIES that he teaches hypnosis! They lying continues…
That
is a complete mistake. All elements of strong human emotion have a
hypnotic aspect to them because they are taking place subconsciously.
So
wait a minute… MINE’99 doesn’t really teach hypnosis? No more NLP
based material? No weasel phrases? No Blowjob patterns? He must have
completely dropped synesthisia and embedded commands. No more
hap-PENIS. No sir. Speed Seduction has now evolved to a kinder,
gentler, and even less effective form of seduction, ladies and
gentlemen. Huzzah!
Dr. Phil: Are you teaching hypnosis or anything related to hypnosis?
Ross: No! No – I am teaching something far more disturbing, and I want you to listen to this.
By
the way, that was a hypnotic command, but whatever. I love how all of
MINE’99s sales material and course material is all based around
hypnosis, and here he is blatantly LYING and saying it isn’t. He also
never said how much more disturbing the stuff he teaches is, he just
kind of leaves it at that – which could possibly be the first true
thing he said the entire interview.
So Dr. Phil finally asks "What is it you do???" To which MINE’99 responds:
"I teach men how to use language with women to evoke strong emotion."
Really?
Wow – sounds like hypnosis to me! Go figure. I mean, isn’t that NLP?
Using language to evoke desired emotion? NLP = hypnosis last I checked.
Even in MINE’99s example of what he teaches, he describes a hypnotic
induction loaded with weasel phrases and embedded commands, then talks
about mirroring her answers back to her. Yeah, that’s not hypnosis.
Riiiiiiiight.
Even the women in the audience look like they can’t believe the bullshit MINE’99 is spinning!
Let me ask you something, dear reader… for a man who claims to
teach other men how to influence women, why is it he can’t freakin’
influence Dr. Phil, a room full of women, and an entire television
audience?
BECAUSE HE’S FULL OF SHIT.
Always has been. And always will be.
Ross is a liar. He’s an insecure little dweeb. He’s a hateful,
spiteful person. He is incredibly selfish. He cares about no one
other than himself. He’s been teaching seduction for decades and is
still single. All his best students have moved on to different methods
of seduction. All his closest friends, allies and business partners
have deserted him.
You ever wonder why this is?
Simple: He’s a fake. And not only is he a fake, he’s a MEAN fake
no one likes. At least Tyler Durden is charismatic enough so people
overlook the fact he’s a raging sociopath. Ross can’t even be that
intelligent – even when he’s on national TV. He spends all his time
attacking and bad mouthing other people and can’t even fully describe
what it is he does.
This is the problem with MINE’99, and always has been. He focuses
so much on all the NEGATIVE stuff, he never comes across as likable or
sympathetic. If you ask me – he should be taking as many pick up
workshops as possible, because it’s obvious if he just got laid a few
times, he might chill out. But no, he keeps being the faker. The
insecure virgin. The loser he always has been.
Here’s my final word on the matter:
Men need to learn from people who can actually do what they say
they’ll do. They need teachers who aren’t more messed up than they
are. They need people who won’t lie to them and will treat them
honestly. They need guidance from experienced teachers.
Mystery Method is all of those things. Ross is none of them.
And this video proves that.
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narkologicheskaya klinika_pzSl on 
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My version of what went down on the Dr. Phil show:
http://www.speedseduction.biz/blog/
To the haters, keep right on hating, especially Vince.
RJ
Ross Jeffries wrote:
“At which point I turned my back on him, looked right in the camera and said, “If anyone here in the audience or anyone watching this at home thinks that this show isn’t heavily scripted and edited to manipulate your emotions, welcome to your fantasy world!”
No wonder they hit you in the editing room.
This is such a faux pas. You embarrass Dr.Phil on his own show, in front of HIS audience.
Ahahahahahaha
WHAT were you thinking??
I suggest you take some courses on basic social skills.
“This is such a faux pas. You embarrass Dr.Phil on his own show, in front of HIS audience.
Ahahahahahaha
WHAT were you thinking??”
why not, Dr Phib does it to his guests
“why not, Dr Phib does it to his guests”
Yes, but he is a success with a massive audience.
RJ isn’t.
So, RJ shouldn’t be biting the hand that could potentially feed him.
wow Ross Jeffries is old! personally if it was a looks/physical attraction thing, he would come off as a predator to the younger generation. Nothing more sad than an aging hipster.
A few things…
First of all – I honestly don’t care how many responses my posts get. This blog has always been about one thing and one thing only – what I find interesting. I’m not manufacturing a “flame war” with Ross to get traffic to my blog. I could care less. The massive discussion going on in my RSD Sucks post is inconsequential to my feelings on this topic. Fact is, Ross put his foot in his own ass, and I felt the need to comment on it. Period.
Second, the notion that I “collaborate” with Ross on anything is ridiculous. I hate this guy. Hate him with seven passions. I get the creeps just THINKING about this dude. He has done so much to screw me and so many other people over, I would never, ever, ever want to work with or associate myself to this douchebag in any way. The truth is, he HAS emailed me in the past begging to flame him (especially during the time when he was breaking up with Yates), but I just ignored his lame attempts to get attention. The fact is, I still have all the “cease and desist” emails he sent me in the past threatening to sue me and stuff if I kept bad mouthing him. So the notion that I do this to make money with Ross “in secret” or whatever is bunk. Remember, ROSS LIES. Anything that comes out of that man’s mouth is a lie. So to believe his word on a subject is just lame.
Finally, MINE’99 links to his blog about what “really” happened on the show. In case you can’t tell, RJ always seems to like to try and re-frame stuff in his favor, even when it obviously isn’t. If that video of him on Dr. Phil claiming he doesn’t teach hypnosis and his marketing is completely misrepresentational convinces you he’s a liar – the why on earth would anyone EVER believe a single word he’s written on his lame-ass blog?
Ross Jeffries is – and always will be – a phony. And I feel sorry for anyone who actually takes the time to learn his stuff, because they are in for a world of hurt when they do.
Thundercat
Exactly man. Ross has no social skills at all, they are terrible. He has no ability to put himself in anyone elses shoes at all. To top it off he has no ability to look at his own behavior and interprete it in any form that is even close to accurate. He thinks he is sending certain messages but really he is sending a totally different message. Not a guy you want to learn to hypnotise yourself or improve yourself from.
This guy has one knack and that is to manipulate and hypnotise a girls emotions to get what he wants, and even that doesn’t really work. The basics of it in a creative and free environment where you have a girl to yourself and into you are the best times to make practice of what he teaches, and it should just be in being aware that women can vividly picture things, so try to paint vivid pictures for her on what you want her to feel. This is basic knowledge and long routines and weird arm motions dont have enough of an extra effect to make it worth the downsides to learning it….
Also I read his little link, he talks about how girls are interested in learning more — the guy actually thinks they are interested in it for any other reason than to try to make sure she can pinpoint some guy doing creepy things? Of cource ross cant figure out the motivation behind them getting in contact with him, because he thinks of no point of view besides his own narrowminded sick and twisted views.
He still carries on about how he is the reason for the community, he still carries on that going up and having an interesting conversation with someone is evil (MM GUYS) and yet his ways are more evil than any of that. Talk about hypocritical. This guy is so lost that it’s actually quite sad.
” And I feel sorry for anyone who actually takes the time to learn his stuff, because they are in for a world of hurt when they do”
How so? Do you have examples? I have gotten more hurt from using deangelos cocky funny insults on women or “negging” women with mm.
“Also I read his little link, he talks about how girls are interested in learning more — the guy actually thinks they are interested in it for any other reason than to try to make sure she can pinpoint some guy doing creepy things? Of cource ross cant figure out the motivation behind them getting in contact with him, because he thinks of no point of view besides his own narrowminded sick and twisted views. ”
If a women were to do that she would have to be really paranoid. In addition, all the guys I have met in the field in bars all use MM or spent $40 bucks on a a david D book , the average women would be hard pressed to find a ss’r in the bars. even so, what would someone tell her “Run, this guy is going to make you feel good talkikng to you with descriptive language that makes you experience things no one has ever made you experience before”…oh, how horrible
Wow, Ross Jeffries is disgusting. The MM instructors don’t look all that cool either – the bald dude sounds like a computer programmer, the other one slightly peeved with an annoying effeminate voice. Really, this is the best they have to offer?
Non-related, but I wonder if less attractive girls respond worse to direct approaches than attractive girls, all else equal. Maybe the novelty of it creeps them out, because they get approached less.
“The massive discussion going on in my RSD Sucks post is inconsequential to my feelings on this topic.” You sound incredibly self-absorbed, i.e. not open to addressing conflicting views. I have no set view on the matter in question, but you’ve basically said to hell with fair judgement in any case. It’s fine to not seek out the answers for some issue, of course, but it’s irresponsible to project your resulting ignorance.
I cant speak for day game, because honestly — I dont really do it.
What I CAN tell you is that in clubs and bars the best looking women respond to a laid back down to earth vibe. In a way David tries to communicate this to you, but he goes a little too far with the bitterness and hating. You can tell he is damaged.
Rsd gets a lot of stuff right with the bar, but THEY go to far with the entertainment and weird vibe — which you have to watch out for. Follow their inner game advice over their outer game advice — they have some outer game gems but follow it to a tea and your sunk as an entertainer.
Then we have MM and all it’s outlets or copycats. There are a lot of things they get right. The big critism I have is two fold. First is that the mp3 model is linear and really you shouldnt think of interactions as stages. The big thing it contributes is a lot of the proper ways to go about interactions in a natural and non-linear way. If your too focused on routines and scripts though, it will take you down. You really need the self confidence, fluidity, freedom, self expression, creativity, and masculinity as well as the ability to put yourself in favorable situations in order to really bring it home. The general concepts and mindsets behind the general ideas at how to approach an interaction however, are solid.
What RJ teaches is just downright creepy, he knows that and that is why he is trying to teach inner game now. In principle making women feel good emotions and painting a picture towards what you want is insanely effective, but it must be done creatively, on the spot, and in a lowkey manner. Learning his routines and using some of his structure and buzzwords is just downright faggotry. If you boil down the general concept in a natural way though, it can take you from a day 2 that doesnt go anywhere, to one that ends in sex.
Then of course we have Juggler, who covers the angel of a woman who is already interested in you, who views you of higher value — and he covers a lot of how to make yourself attainable to her and comfortable to her. This is valuable stuff too.
My point in all this rambling? You cant look at one guru as the person who can help you master success with women, they cant. They give you different pieces that can be effective in different concepts after a lot of practice and disappointment.
The fact is that in a bar or a club it depends on the situation and the woman. In general a girl that is hot is being drooled on by a lot of men and worshipped. That shit turns them off. The opposite is to try to be a dick like David teaches and that stuff gets old quick too for the women, especially if your energy is fully invested in that vibe. Going into a bar and talking the shit that RJ promotes is certainly creepy and dorky and wont get you anywhere with any woman that is not just ready to go — and if she is ready to go RSD stuff is more consistant and even sometimes can help you turn around a hater girl.
Fact is everybody has their own angle because that is what the missing piece was for them or it suits their style and if they dont differentiate why are you gonna buy their product?
When it comes down to it tho to go on a live television show and shoot down ANYONE else when you are there to represent this movement, is total faggotry. Thats the point in all this.
It seems that everyone knows the answer to my question, but I will ask anyway:
Why do you keep calling RJ MINE’99′? What episode does the nickname relate to?
I actually love RJ. I see it as having so much more integrity than Mystery method. It seems to be true that RJ can’t stand competition and acts unfairly in order to get what he wants. His system of SS is ound though and anyway it hasn’t been about memorising patterns for years. Just a cursory study of his seminars gives an impression of a memorisation and regurtitation system but an in depth study shows it to be about having deeper understandings of the human minds and being able to capture a womans imagination by YOU first making an exploration of your own emotions. I totally support RJ even if he is a bit weird.
“What RJ teaches is just downright creepy, he knows that and that is why he is trying to teach inner game now. In principle making women feel good emotions and painting a picture towards what you want is insanely effective, but it must be done creatively, on the spot, and in a lowkey manner. Learning his routines and using some of his structure and buzzwords is just downright faggotry. ”
that’s funny…you just used two rsd buzzwords yourself…..creepy, coined by tyle durden to cut down ss and “faggotry” used by jlaic to rip on mm routines
Seriously guys.
Just pickup Mehows dvd set…it’s sick.
And listen to BradP’s interviews with
naturals.
COOL GUYS who talk like the rest of the
population.
Oh — I see — so now because RSD uses the word creepy or faggotry — that means it’s THEIR word??
pffffff
screw that shit man
You know it’s time to take a break from being a KJ when your telling someone else what words belong to who and what the underlying meaning being the word term is. lol.
As for Brad P and Mehow I am not sure exactly how “natural” they actually are. The brad P natural interview is “o.k” – but Im not into banging chicks in the bathroom as my hobby. Still — a good lesson on having a natural mindset.
As for Mehow he is a mixed bag, I cant follow all his tech sometimes, he seems to me like he is giving mystery advice if mystery were on “crack” or some shit. I DEFINATELY like his dvd set and am still scratching my head trying to figure out how to make the whole thing work without just taking on a flamer role or something.
Not knocking these guys, just not sure if they are the magic pill answer to everyones issues. lol. Personally I think we just need a normal fucking cool guy to come into this who doesn’t have something mentally wrong with them or make it too ridiculas or weird like all the other god damn weirdo’s tend to do. I mean shit what is this — an insane asylum or what??
See the community objectifies women. It just does. That’s a big part of the problem. We spend all this time coming up with stuff, it’s like we put em on a pedestool. Naturals just really dont make a big deal of anything and are confident to do or say whatever the fuck they want to — and thats what gets real results.
BTW
Thats why Style is considered amoung the best in this community. He is probably the most normal and down to earth person to ever teach this stuff — granted he is a little brainwashed by mystery and that holds constraints on him — and he lacks that inner masculinity and the rebellious balls — but he is like the closest person to normal this place has to offer.
lol.. you call a fucking kike who stole 1 million from people in annihilation method and scams with his stylelife prorgam, normal and down to earth?
style is fucking scum.. filthy jewish rat
14/88
“As for Mehow he is a mixed bag….”
Name a better outer game product.
A newbie comes to you.
‘How do you pu? what does it look like? how does it sound?”
Please, enlighten me.
What’s the better product to purchase in your opinion?
Name it.
Better product?
“Mind of Mystery”
You get to see Mystery hitting on average looking (and below) chicks at a club, with him finally picking up an unattractive 40+ year old.
Later you get to see him when he’s stoned.
You know — I reviewed mehow again last night. These mehow fanatics must be guys that are flamboyant. I mean every single thing he teaches you to do — from touching everyone constantly including men, to being really high energy, to the San francisco handshake — to the way he teases by calling them marcians? It’s all homosexual stuff. Things homo’s do.
This guys whole game has developed in a manner that works for him and whether or not he is aware of it — he has found the game that works best for a guy that girls think is gay.
Sorry — not my style, and not most guys style. To call it the best outer game product? You got to either be gay and in the closet — a KJ newbie — or completely drunk….
I admit the fact he has live field footage and can break down little things in interactions makes him seem really appealing, and some of his advice is super solid like his audio on phone game…but I cant make most of the shit he says to do work — I am a chill masculine dude in a regular town, not a flamboyant skinny hipster running around in San francisco.
I think his game is great for certain people.
yeah if you are effinate weedy fag boy go mehow.
who himself was a virgin til after 30…i m glad its working for him now though…
but it works cos he flys so low under the radar i d let him isolate my girlfriend…
To a noob I would warn them not to get into this at all. People make it too overly complicated, and there are too many strong frame personalities that want to push their weird and individualistic personalities on you. If you don’t live in LA or San fran with all the wild freaks, a lot of the advice is just totally lame for normal american people and girls. Try running around like Mehow in 80 percent of this country. lol.
This community is exposing weak minded men to take their money. Everyone has their own story. It takes years to figure out all the bits and pieces that will work for you and then of course in the mix of things you gotta try to figure out yourself. By the time you finally get close to doing all that and putting it together — your life has fallen apart because you have spent so much focus on this and lost yourself.
My suggestion???
Keep it simple.
If you wanna learn from someone, learn from an inner game guy first and just go out and do your thing. I would say Hypnotica is great.
Outer game?
If your a nice guy and a noob afc — try the old book “how to succeed with women”
It gives you some practical and simple advice and kind of sums up what I have found to be overall the general best way to think about women. It doesnt make you come from a misoganist or fear based view. Some of the advice it gives is a little weak or girlie — and comes from a dating frame — but the mindsets and inner game advice is sound.
You need to go out staying as much true to yourself as possible. These two references will take an AFC and make him a more effective AFC. If he starts approaching girls he doesn’t know and doing his thing then he is going to learn a lot about who he is and how women respond to it.
Only after he has a good idea of his sticking points and problems — should he then find a forum and get some feedback — or better yet get himself a telephone call with a guru. They usually are under 100 bucks. He will give him personalized instruction to help him to go from there.
Other guys will come on and laugh at the hypnotica and how to succeed with women references because they dont teach PUA mentalities and tend to focus on having healthy normal mindsets. However if you master the stuff hypnotica teaches your going to be very confident, and with how to succeed with women your going to have healthy mindsets — and by not studying any outer game structure your going to have the chance to figure out who you are, what decisions you make in the field, and how girls react to you based on who you are. Then and ONLY then will you know what direction you need to take, and thats the time to call up a phone coach, is once you know how to explain the problems your having being who you are. That coach will then give you direction.
Another great read for a beginner that doesn’t brainwash him is “The book of pook” this is a good compliment to “success with women” both of them teach a good foundation that tends to warn you of the pitfalls of this journey and points you in the right general direction while allowing you to stay true to who you really are so that you can be going out in the field feeling congruent and confident, learning from your mistakes, and eventually going to a professional over the phone who you will explain your SP’s too and who will give you direction how to fix them based on who you are and what specific SP’s that brings on.
The book of pook is a free ebook on the internet.
mack wild:
” To call it the best outer game product? You got to either be gay and in the closet — a KJ newbie — or completely drunk….”
Got you angry didn’t I. Did you notice that your anger lowered you to calling me names?
“I admit the fact he has live field footage and can break down little things in interactions makes him seem really appealing”
It is EXACTLY that, that no other company currently offers that is of such high value.
Mr. “Wild” learn, THINK…how to separate the SUBSTANCE from the STYLE.
“I don’t like his style” doesn’t cut it.
So, there’s this 8 DVD set of infield footage, where REAL INTERACTIONS are broken down, SECOND by SECOND by a guy with very high analytical capabilities. This is the SUBSTANCE part. Sorry for shouting, but I’m trying to get through to you.
The 8 DVDS of live infield footage, which is then broken down second by second is NOT, a lot of well-articulated bullshit. I state this, because, a lot of what is on the market, is a lot of well-articulated bullshit. Smooth wordsmanship.
The analysis of the interactions are solid, easy to understand, no brainer, dissections.
A newbie comes to me and says “I want to learn PU, what does it look like? how does it sound? what do you do when girls react certain way? I heard there are these workshop things, but they cost $3000 with airfare and all that, what would you recommend”
Then I would say. “well Mack, before you go out, you need to have SOME idea of what you’re doing, and what the responses might mean, for example, you could go out there and say “toe jam” to a girl, and she may kiss you, and then you may mistakenly construe that ‘toe jam’ is an awesome pickup line, so to avoid that kind of unfortunate thinking, I want you to watch this product by Mehow, and, it’s only around $400, $500, not only that…but, you can REWIND, and REVIEW, and HEAR and SEE what pu looks like, THIS is crucial Mack, you don’t have to like the guy, or his style, but, an interaction, is an interaction”
There isn’t a better outer game product.
Sorry.
Oh please, it IS a cartel.
Oh please…you are mentally ill.
It’s like a chain of supermarkets that only sells Pepsi while acting like Coca-Cola doesn’t exist.
Never seen a supermarket just sell Pepsi…you get out alot huh.
It’s circle-jerk marketing
Bet you know alot about that. Write another loser method, call it Blistered Hands, or Jerking guys off doesn’t mean I’m gay…snicker.
Whatever you claim to be, you’re just another anonymous internet cockroach who wants to be taken seriously without scrutiny. Real alphas don’t hide.
Said the man that got his ass beat by an elderly man.HAHA.
Said the man who is afraid to talk to a girl…you are such a loser, Ray.
Btw, the “strip club challenge” was Mystery vs. the strippers to see who was lying about whether or not they go home with customers.
The challenge YOU backed out on…everyone knows you have no game….such a retard.
The link between the community and white supremacists is genuine and easily proven. Anyone would be a fool to give up their information as customers and risk that type of harassment if they speak up.
LOL….call the FBI…oh wait…they dont take your calls any longer…snicker.
We saw how you used customers info to harass them…the ONE customer you had…that said your crap was just that…CRAP
People here talk about how lame it is to flame the competition yet that’s all they ever do to me.
Poor baby….maybe if you knew ANYTHING about women…all you do is flame hoping to make someone mad enough for you to sue….you are such a pussy.
The rules about flaming them are the same as for flaming anyone, me or otherwise. Don’t try taking the high road after so many years on the low.
Said the kettle to the pot. HEy!…you still trying to harass Ashley?….just another woman who would not spit on you if you were on fire.
Ray, tell me…what underage gym girl are you stalking now?
Ray….BORNLOSER
It’s always puzzled me how much nonsense there is in this stupid, idiotic community.
Over the years I’ve read all the stuff I could. I started out with a little SS and it creeped me out a bit, but I used some of it to success, I used some Mystery stuff, some David D stuff, RSD stuff, etc.
Really, who gives a FUCK!
I’ve gotten more pussy now learning all this shit than I ever would have gotten before I learned about the “community”.
Oh, and I rarely cold approach, and I’m probably far less attractive than most out there.
But I have a fucking personality.
And these “techniques” gave me an outlet to not be afraid putting that out there.
The problem is, most of the people studying this shit never had a personality in the first place, and unfortunately I’ve come to the conclusion that they probably never will. Or they’re still harboring all this negative shit from the days that girls pushed them down on the school yard and made everyone laugh at them.
Get over that shit, all of you grow the fuck up, be goddamn men and fucking live your life. Pussies.
I’ll go back to being anonymous and laughing at the idiocy I read on these boards day after day.
I honestly believe that if you guys were pulling the ass you’re supposed to be pulling, none of these retarded arguments would even surface.
But thank you to the community as a whole, even RJ and his crackpot ideas, for enabling me to pretty much be able to get any girl I want.
Isn’t that all that really matters anyways?
you sound angry … you need to learn how to relax its not healthy bro
Thunderfart blarted:
“Second, the notion that I “collaborate” with Ross on anything is ridiculous. I hate this guy. Hate him with seven passions. I get the creeps just THINKING about this dude. He has done so much to screw me and so many other people over, I would never, ever, ever want to work with or associate myself to this douchebag in any way.”
Thundercat is an affiliate of my website and has cheerfully accepted his monthly commissions I pay him, via PayPal.
The guy is only about $$$$$$$$$$$ and if he thinks flaming me viciously will pull in site traffic he’ll do it.
And now I’ve proven him to be a liar.
If he denies it, I’ll post a list of his commissions and the date they were paid for the past 6 months.
RJ
Voltaire,
I don’t hate mehow in fact I enjoy watching the sarges I have seen and his breakdowns of them. I’m just saying that his “method”, his lines, and a lot of the ways he responds to things — is working because the girls see him as a homosexual.
It is well documented by MM that he only was laid once in 2005. I believe that Mehow runs very high energy game and comes off flamboyantly gay. This allows him to get away with a lot of stuff. The entire game he has developed — things that he has found to work for him — is a result of this gay vibe he gives off. His disqualification is the subcommunication that he is gay.
One of the things that fascinates me about a lot of the guys who get into this community (50 percent are virgins) is how easily impressed they are. Look the fact of the matter is that anyone with about a month of going out 3-4 times a week can develope game that is sharp enough to work a room, get some quick makeouts, get some phone numbers ect. You can make it LOOK like your a pimp…however a lot of these methods and show-offs are smoke screens. These guys arn’t actually getting laid.
I don’t believe that Mehow’s game supports him getting laid and if it does it is because he is able to hook them in with the gay vibe and then bait and switch them with the lifestyle he leads. Any girl that DOES end up laying him is most certainly a gold digger on some level. It’s not his game, his game just allows him to entertain and be a dancing monkey and get away with any kino or other shit because number 1 no guy is going to get pissed because he thinks the guy is gay and number 2 the girls just justify he is a fun flamboyant gay guy friend.
Yes you can learn some stuff from watching him but 70 percent of it is unusable unless you want to play the flamboyant role. I don’t — and I couldnt pull it off even if I tried anyhow.
You want an outer game product that is solid and is more likely to allow for real results? Try foundations by RSD — their only program with a bit of tangability — you still will run into the dancing monkey Sticking Point that is prevelant in other mystery clone products but they basically are teaching a simplified and somewhat natural spin to the method without the incongruence problem that MM’s “comfort” phase brings on.
P.S
Oh and RJ we all fuckin know thundercat is all about trying to make some money — do you think that is a shock to any of us? Your all about your ego as dilluded as it is and he is all about the money — you guys are a match made in hell. You should kiss and make up.
Mack wild—this is Thundercat’s blog, not yours.
You need psychiatric help.
Maybe RJ will take you on at a discount.
Now I’ve gotta get back out….
I should add: mack wild obviously hasn’t bothered watching RJ’s 1999 and 2000 seminars. The second one is especially good. You can get them for free via torrent, like I did. Takes about a day to download. If they change your mind, consider giving Ross a reasoanble donation.
Btw, his “Nail Your Inner Game” shit—which I bought partly to compensate him for illegally downloading all his previous material—is not worth $600. It would have been good as a $20 ebook. It’s just a rehash and reorganization of previous inner game stuff, and a theft of Tyler’s shtick. The actual content could literally be condensed into a paragraph, and the only remotely new thing about it—as he admits—is the sequence of exercises.
Thundercat and RJ gossip and whine more than bitches do
both of you are fuckin ridiculous
I love the little faggots that come on and take shots at personal shots at people they don’t know over the internet and arn’t even man enough to leave their real nickname. These are the kind of people you see in real person who actually really HAVE psychological problems — and pocket protectors…
Ive seen that crap in 2000. Anyone who advocates RJ is a total nerd. End of story.
I love the little faggots that come on and take shots at personal shots at people they don’t know over the internet and arn’t even man enough to leave their real nickname.
Their nicjname huh…wow…you are an idiot.
A moron.
These are the kind of people you see in real person who actually really HAVE psychological problems — and pocket protectors…
No they are people like YOU…people who do not have the mental capacity to grasp SS.
Whats the matter, no new canned openers for you…haha.
Ive seen that crap in 2000. Anyone who advocates RJ is a total nerd. End of story.
The other methods get you laid, SS gets you stalked. Sorry RJ could not teach it on your level….crayons and shit.
Are you Rays brother by the way?
Gee, how cute to see people who are so SCARED of competing against me ……
HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHA….you can’t pick up a hooker…you are the biggest joke in the seduction area. You are the biggest pussy that dares call himself male.
With me they don’t even bother talking about my writing, as they often use my teachings, but lies made up years ago by others.
Oh they talk about, how stupid and unworkable it is. How there is NO method there at all. How you can’t sale the crap, even give it away.
You make money on your porn ads on your site….loser.
I wonder how Dr. Phil would have reacted ……
LMAO…Phil would rip you apart and spit you out….he would have you crying like the little baby you are….Whaaaaaaa
or showed him some of the offline harassment directed ag my dying mother, “warning” her that her primary caregiver shouldn’t be living with her.
You a caregiver….LOL. I bet she wished she was on the pill about time you showed up. Oh god….another retardo.
When the whole truth about this CARTEL comes out on TV ……
Snicker….yeah Ray, they are all against you….why do you get banned everywhere you go? Stripperweb banned your ass….so much for your stripper gold product….hahahahaha
– and you can be sure it will, as the media is starting to ask me about it — let’s see who is where.
If IF…IF…they would never ask about YOU…1 minute into an interview with you and they will know you are a nutbag….just like that interview over Penn…half the web was calling you a moron and idiot.
Ray gets another Drink threw in his face….WE know where the video is…..hahahahah
Mack Wild
I share the same views you have, there is a lot of shit going around in this community.
But there is also some very good stuff:
RSD Blueprint Decoded, Hypnotica’s stuff.
Lovedrop’s Revelation book I think will be great. Jugglers stuff is also good for vibing.
The best “PUAs” to learn from for everybody I think are Sinn and Tim from RSD, as not only do they have the best skills, but their knowledge is very applicable and effective in real life.
Thundercat say it ain’t so:
“Thundercat is an affiliate of my website and has cheerfully accepted his monthly commissions I pay him, via PayPal.
The guy is only about $$$$$$$$$$$ and if he thinks flaming me viciously will pull in site traffic he’ll do it.
And now I’ve proven him to be a liar.
If he denies it, I’ll post a list of his commissions and the date they were paid for the past 6 months.”
Thundercat please respond to this, the fact that you’ve been staying quiet so far after him spurting this crap out, makes me think you’ve probably been doing business with this creep.
Deny this bullshit, if it isn’t for real. If you keep quiet, your showing that you can’t be trusted and he is telling the truth. If you deny it and he doesn’t show nothing, than this beyond a doubt shows that he’s a compulsive liar.
Thundercat say it ain’t so:
“Thundercat is an affiliate of my website and has cheerfully accepted his monthly commissions I pay him, via PayPal.
The guy is only about $$$$$$$$$$$ and if he thinks flaming me viciously will pull in site traffic he’ll do it.
And now I’ve proven him to be a liar.
If he denies it, I’ll post a list of his commissions and the date they were paid for the past 6 months.”
Thundercat please respond to this, the fact that you’ve been staying quiet so far after him spurting this crap out, makes me think you’ve probably been doing business with this creep.
Deny this bullshit, if it isn’t for real. If you keep quiet, your showing that you can’t be trusted and he is telling the truth. If you deny it and he doesn’t show nothing, than this beyond a doubt shows that he’s a compulsive liar.
It’s an open secret in the community that Thundy’s a business partner of Ross’s. Hell, they’re both affiliated with Neil Strauss’s Stylelife company openly.
I’m just surprised it’s taken this long for anyone to find out.
Ares,
I am very very much looking forward to the revelations book.
Im also looking forward to Tims product.
Lets hope these guys can bring some normalcy to all this.
Mack:
“Voltaire,
“I don’t hate mehow”
Never said you did.
Mack wrote:
“I’m just saying that his “method”, his lines, and a lot of the ways he responds to things — is working because the girls see him as a homosexual.”
How the hell do you know? you don’t. This is what you *think* as a male watching him. Ok,
let’s say he’s getting the responses because of a gay vibe, who cares?
I know very effeminate men who get laid like rockstars. In Greenes book “The Art of Seduction”
he talks about this archetype. You don’t like it, whatever, it works.
Here’s Mehows partner in business, he seems like your style: youtube.com/watch?v=D0wLZ1AwHZU&feature=related
was that alpha enough for you? That’s the best damn sarge on video I’ve seen, EVER. Alpha male jerk in the club, smooth talker outside in private. That’s how it’s done for a guy with THAT kind of a build and vibe.
He was making out with her in case you didn’t notice. Not just getting numbers.
“It is well documented by MM that he only was laid once in 2005.”
What year is it now?
“One of the things that fascinates me about a lot of the guys who get into this community (50 percent are virgins) is how easily impressed they are.”
1) how do you know that 50% of the community are virgins? how do you know all of these guys…you must be an instructor for some company to know this.
I also notice how you give yourself credibility by throwing down actual numbers. It almost sounds like you actually know what you’re talking about. You don’t.
2) you are suggesting that I’m easily impressed, and therefore my appreciation for Mehows product doesn’t warrant much merit.
LOL. You don’t know me.
I think FR’s are b.s. I think ANY company not producing AT LEAST the instructors demoing their technique are guilty of fraudulence until proven innocent. We are aware that the 3 day “fantasy camps” ( credit Sinn) have a 90% failure rate.
I’ve been on a bootcamp. 1st night was great, 2nd and 3rd nights were redundant.
I can say, I can approach and open a group of people now. Getting laid?? hooooly shiit.
That’s a whole different can of worms that doesn’t get any attention. “the game is played in comfort” ( credit Mystery)… the bootcamp I was on, could haaardly get to comfort.
“I don’t believe that Mehow’s game supports him getting laid ”
That’s an entirely different arguement, clean up your thinking, plus it’s irrelevant. He posts live interactions and breaks them down with precision.
So, a newbie can now open, and get to comfort at least.
I could care less if he gets laid or not. I know that this product is better
than any other product for showing how, let’s say, the beginning of a PU
SOUNDS, and what it LOOKS LIKE, and how to handle interupts, and amogs, and calibration.
This is a head and shoulders start above anything else offered out there.
On Bootcamp, the instructors couldn’t hear me, I couldn’t hear them…it was chaos. His product is not chaos.
“Yes you can learn some stuff from watching him but 70 percent of it is unusable unless you want to play the flamboyant role. ”
Are you sure it’s 70%, why not 82%, or 37%, do realize how utterly arbitrary you are?
You are actually making up stories. You are actually telling yourself little stories.
Tons of the stuff is useable. OK. so. You don’t want to go in ‘gay’. No problem. Don’t. Go in any way you want. Now you’re in ok?? Got it? There’s still takeaways, little negs, handling interupts, amogs. Messy stuff. Stuff that you simply cannot read about, and is completely indifferent to any ‘style’ you choose to approach in.
“You want an outer game product that is solid and is more likely to allow for real results? Try foundations by RSD”
It’s official. You’re in LaLa Land.
That’s not only NOT an outer game product, and not only NOT an Inner Game product, it’s a product of the RSD instructors talking ABOUT their stories, and ‘the game’ as they know it. A feel good product, come and be one of the boys feel good product, “look at who we have on our team, aren’t they likeable?, come join our nation.”
I’m not saying it’s good or bad, it’s just NOT an outer game product. But, you don’t get this…for some totally bizarre, but, kind of fascinating ( like a car wreck ) way.
If little Johnny came to you and said, “what does pu look like? and sound like? and what do you do when other guys come around?”
Are you for real, actually suggesting, that you would hand him “Transformations” ( an, ‘here’s our team product’) over raw, live, infield footage?? That you can HEAR, and SEE, rewind, and go over and over again?
You’re out of your mind.
Ok Mack.
Best of luck,
The Mehow Infield Insider product is currently the best outer game product on the market.
Sorry.
p.s. TD from 2003 – 2004 – awesome btw.
good comeback volitaire or do you prefer to be called mehow?
Here’s Mehows partner in business, he seems like your style: youtube.com/watch?v=D0wLZ1AwHZU&feature=related
was that alpha enough for you?
umm totally dude, that IS my style — Loved it.
By the way I did NOT suggest transformations — i suggested “FOUNDATIONS” and clearly your not familiar with that product because your comments were way off. It’s just tyler and he is breaking down the basics of outer game in a natural way that suits ANYONES style.
I am not going to get into a pissing contest with you as to the rest of it. Obviously I have not conducted a survey taking actual percentages. I have however been around long enough to go out with lairs, have many wings, and interact with hundreds of forum members and have private conversations with them via PM — so my numbers arn’t TOO far off. Those numbers are just semantics to make a point and you know this.
As for your argument about seeing live infield footage and no other product brings that value?? Can’t argue with that, just wish the method he was teaching was more usable for the general population, thats all.
You do indeed pick up good skills for handling curveballs (amogs, shit tests) — although a lot of the suggestions are a little gay — you can at least notice what it looks like, and if you take some of the underlying message though and can piece it together to come up with your own way of refuting — then yeah that can be valuable too.
So you make some good points, my point was simply that it would be nice to have a product like that from someone who runs game that is a little more “masculine”. I know what it’s like to be a dancing monkey, and I know others who do it too — doesn’t = anything beyond club fun by any stretch of the imagination. It’s only a small step, a step that if overdone can lead to problems down the road for sure.
It’s been a stimulating conversation none the less. Thanks.
“As for your argument about seeing live infield footage and no other product brings that value?? Can’t argue with that”
Finally.
You’re right, you did say Foundations, and not Transformations.
Foundations, I watched one hour of it then turned it off. The speaker contradicts himself within the hour. A philosophy prof. would have a field day with him.
And now, I’m actually talking about a guy in a room ….arrrggghhhh.
Which is about 200% lower in value than having ACTUAL LIVE VIDEO.
No, I’m not Mehow. After that ridiculous bootcamp I was on, I waited years for a product like this to come out. I knew the companies wouldn’t do it because of course it makes bootcamps redundant. It’s better than bootcamps for a newbie, because on a $3000 bootcamp you cannot HEAR each other, then there’s the instructors!!!! Don’t get me started. Also, with vid, you can rewind!! That’s nice for the finer points.
The cash grab is almost over Mack. Almost.
And you know what…ultimately, in the long run, it’ll be good for both you and me.
Maybe another company will cave in, and you’ll get your Alpha Infield Product…cool eh!! but, remember who started the trend.
Ciao.
Yeah definately man. I mean don’t get me wrong — I have more respect for mehow than 90 percent of the other guys out there. I agree about RSD contradictions and I will shit my pants, throw them in a blender and drink them down with a pinch of sugar if RSD ever were to come out with a product like Mehows. So I am not discrediting the value of that sort of setup at all. Just jealous that it doesn’t fit into my game.
agreed i’d love to see a genuine in field rsd production that lived upto their outlandish claims….
How does tyler contradict himself?
style and mystery got me in the door with women, but rsd got me laid.
thats all i can say about the companies that helped me
SS was just to damn silly. but i can’t totally knock it.
style and mystery got me in the door with women, but rsd got me laid.
thats all i can say about the companies that helped me
SS was just to damn silly. but i can’t totally knock it.