The Top 10 Pick Up Artists Of 2008

January 9, 2009 by  
Filed under Top 10 Lists

Welcome one and all to the Top 10 list of best Pick Up Artists for the year 2008!

2008 was a strange year – for me personally, and for a lot of others, I think.  In many ways, I’m glad the year is over.  But regardless of how good of a year it was, there were many people in the seduction community who continued to rise above petty squabbles and drama and actually help other men improve their lives and their success with women, and this list is a CELEBRATION of those men, who have helped others throughout the past year.

For those of you new to the list, let me explain how the rankings work.  It becomes very easy to get “caught up” in the hype of certain personalities, so I try and rank the Top 10 based on a number of criteria, which I believe must be present to be considered a good “PUA.”  So all of this years winners were ranked based on:

1.  In-Field Performance.  This is basically the skills the PUA displays in the field with women.  Most Top 10s deal with this factor exclusively, but I’ve found that just looking at a guy’s in-field performance can be misleading, since people have off-nights or can get lucky.  That said, their ability to use the techniques in field repeatedly and consistently to get results is a big, big factor in the ranking process.

2.  Innovations.  This is what new outlook or techniques the PUA brings to the table.  It’s easy for any new guy to get good using Mystery Method or any other school of seduction, but then again, that stuff is designed to work!  So being innovative and bringing a new twist, spin, philosophy, technique, or whatever to the mix is also a big deal, because that means the PUA actually has something to contribute to his students and the community as a whole that no one else does.

3.  Teaching Ability.  This is how effectively the PUA can teach what he does to other people, and have them get similar results.  This is another important factor, because it weeds out the people who are just the lucky naturals, and finds the PUAs who have something to offer humanity as a whole.  After all, I don’t care if a guy gets laid a lot.  I care if that guy can get ME laid a lot – and I think the same is true for you.  That is why I factor in the PUA’s ability to teach others into the ranking.

4.  Contributions To The Community.  This is a measure of how much the PUA “gives back” to others in the seduction community.  This factor is all about the PUA’s willingness to help others, the knowledge and experience he’s willing to share, and the compassion he shows to those who need help.  Too many PUAs look down on people not as successful with women as they are, and that’s not what the seduction community is about, so giving back to it should play a factor, in my opinion.

5.  Philosophy.  This comes down to the PUA’s outlook on life, women, and other men in general.  It’s about how they live their lives, and whether they’re consistent with it.  Some PUAs spout great philosophy, but don’t really believe in it or practice it.  But it’s that core foundations which will influence their students, so I believe this is important in factoring the rankings.

6.  Likability.  One of the things I base my ranking on is whether I actually like the PUA or not.  This is a subjective thing, but I feel its important, because there’s usually a reason I don’t like someone, and that reason has to do with them being a fake, fraud, evil bastard, or what have you.  I like to think I have a fairly decent “B.S. Radar,” so when I meet a PUA in person, I can usually tell if they are legit or not after getting to know them, which is why I tend to rank PUAs I have actually met in real life.  If I haven’t met them, I need to get good feedback from at least 3 sources I trust to make the decision to rank them in this category.

Okay, so now that you know how I rank the list, let’s get to it!

The Top 10 PUAs Of 2008!

1.  Brad P.

Choosing the #1 Pick Up Artist of 2008 was a difficult decision, since there were so many great choices, but in the end, I had to give the edge to Brad P.  Last year, I ranked Brad P. as #5, but in 2008 I really got to know Brad better and got to see what he was up to.

First off, I have to say that Brad is, in my opinion, the most prolific PUA working right now.  Not only does the guy have a workshop schedule that would make an Olympic Athlete break down and cry (yes, Brad actually teaches all his workshops himself), he also is able to produce an insane number of products teaching guys everything from planning the perfect date to what kind of clothes to wear out to the club.

Brad also has an excellent course which he calls his 30/30 club.  This is a monthly course where Brad himself actually makes the content – no minions do the work for him – and it is quite excellent.

Brad also is an incredible innovator.  When I first ranked him, I thought he was a borderline Mystery Method clone, but the more I got to learn about his methods, the more I saw that they were very original.  This is a guy who I believe will actually take the community in new and exciting directions in the future.

Brad is also a great teacher.  He has an uncanny knack for explaining what he does to others, and help them to get similar results.  The guy is also not afraid to demonstrate – on demand – his techniques.  Obviously, sometimes Brad crashes and burns (a fact he readily admits), but part of Brad’s charm is that he’s not the “uber guru” who can do the infamous five-out-of-five.  Rather, he’s a normal guy, but he tends to succeed more than he fails, and he does so with incredible creativity and good humor.

Brad is the type of guy who is willing to bend over backwards for his students.  He may be sick, exhausted, and not feel like approaching a girl, but if a student is in trouble, he’ll still push himself to demonstrate and show the guy how its done.

Brad also has a great attitude.  He readily talks about coming from a troubled upbringing which helped him form a very positive outlook on life and a great deal of self discipline.  There is no ego to Brad, which makes him very easy to relate to.  He really is the type of guy men want to be friends with and women want to be with, and he handles it extremely well.

Plus, Brad gets some wicked attractive girls.  It seems like every time I talk to the guy he’s got a different girl coming over, lol.

If you’d like to learn more about Brad P, you can visit his website at

2.  AFC Adam Lyons

Last year I debuted Adam at #3 in my Top 10 list, but this year he’s moved up to #2.  I must say, it was a hard decision NOT to give the guy the #1 spot this year, since Adam is, without a doubt, one of the hottest up-and-coming stars in the community in my humble opinion.

As some of you are well aware, Adam and I have become good friends since we first met in 2007, and he’s even co-hosted my podcast.  So surely, some people are going to cry fowl that I’m ranking him so highly.  To those people, I say – “If you don’t believe me, believe what you see for yourself.”

Adam has tons and TONS of video out on the internet that proves this guy’s skill.  Everything from a one-minute kiss close to getting a threesome, all with girls most guys would cut their right arm off to get a shot at.

Adam is, for lack of a better word, absolutely crazy.  He is the “mad genius” of pick up, willing to do whatever just to see if it works, so as an innovator, he’s at the top.  Most of this stems from the fact that Adam, more than any other PUA I’ve met, likes to have FUN, and as we all know, fun is attractive to women!

Speaking of which, Adam has been criticized by some because he’s one of the prominent PUAs out there with a real, live girlfriend.  The typical argument is “How can a guy with a girlfriend possibly teach me how to get girls?”  Well, speaking from experience, relationship game is like the uber-high-level mark of a master PUA, so a guy who’s in a healthy relationship with a girl is probably more qualified to teach others about women than most love-em-and-leave-em PUAs.

Adam has also been hard at work teaching workshops all over the world, and is a staple in the lairs and various events within the community.  This probably makes him the most accessible PUA out there for many.  He’s a prolific poster, and he’s willing to meet pretty much anyone.

Adman’s new website,, is just getting going, but it’s sure to be a great resource with Adam teaching everyone through video instruction.  In fact, Adam has also appeared on a number of other products released in 2008 – none of which were his own!  So its obvious that not only does he have a lot to offer, but we’ve only scratched the surface of what Adam is going to be contributing to the community.

And when it comes to his students, very few others inspire such loyalty and devotion.  The fact is, much like Brad P., Adam’s students actually get RESULTS, which is the best indicator of whether a PUA is legit.  Adam’s “no game” game is easy to learn, effective, and super-fun to do.

Adam is also a great guy, who’s always got something fun and positive to say.  That great attitude, combined with his skills as a teacher and a pick up artist, make him one of the best out there in my opinion.  It will be interesting to see how he fares in 2009, especially against the likes of Brad P.

Learn more about Adam at

3.  Style

Yes, what Top 10 list would be complete without the Godfather himself – Style!  I’m sure you’re all aware of my undying fondness of Neil and his skills, having ranked the man as #1 almost consistently since I started the Top 10 back in 2004.  Last year he lost out to Mystery, slipping to #2, and this year he drops one more point to #3.

But make no mistake – I was seriously considering ranking Style at #1 this year again.  After all, if you had a No-Holds-Barred Steel Cage match between Style, Brad P, and AFC Adam, I am convinced the only man left standing at the end would be Neil.  The sheer skill level this man has in social situations dwarfs anything seen by either Brad P. or Adam.

But alas, this ranking is not just about skill.  One of the unfortunate side-effects of being one of “the best” in the game is that you’ll naturally withdraw from the mere mortals who got you there in the first place.  Style was marginally quiet in 2008, mostly because he was writing some new books that had nothing to do with the Game.

However, through his Stylelife company, he still contributed a number of great works, and his seminars were amazing – crossing the “community” barrier to bring in speakers for various different aspects of a guy’s life, like health, fitness, work, time management, etc.

Neil also continues to pull some of the hottest girls I’ve ever seen, and considering that he’s getting older, not growing any more hair on his head, and still isn’t winning any modeling contracts, says a great deal about the guy.

I know Style has gotten a lot of flack recently – mostly from Barry Kirkey, but a good bit from Stephane and other haters as well – but darn it!  I still like the guy!  And I think he’s got a lot to offer others, when he wants to.  Probably the reason I ranked him at #3 is because Style is not as forthcoming as he used to be when it comes to interacting with the community, and we’ve seen very little innovation from the guy in 2008 (though he usually keeps his new stuff to himself, to be fair).

Regardless, there is still no one better in the community to study and learn from than Style, in my humble opinion.  I am still amazed at this guy’s skill, and he was just narrowly beat out this year by two rising stars.

Learn more about Style at:

4.  Mystery

Like Style, no Top 10 list would be complete without Mystery!  The original Grandmaster Poo-Ah of the community is still alive and kicking, though he did drop out of the #1 spot from last year down to number four.  Why such a drop?

Well, I don’t think anyone can argue that 2007 was Mystery’s year.  But 2008 saw very little of the man.  The second season of his TV show came and went without much fan fare, the only major product his company released wasn’t even made by him, and he lost the lawsuit against his former business partner, and his company was forced to admit they misrepresented their claims against them.

On the brighter side of things, Mystery actually was back out in the field teaching workshops again, however, because of his celebrity the argument can be made that he doesn’t have to work too hard at it anymore.

Plus, we have seen almost NOTHING new from Mr. Marchovich in 2008.  He’s still dressing in the same clothes he was three years ago, he’s still teaching the same method he was back in the day, and very little has changed.

However, when it comes to pure raw talent with the ladies, personality, and teaching, it is hard to say there is anyone better than Mystery.  The guy pioneered many of the techniques that have been used and co-opted in other people’s systems.  In fact, I’d say that about 85% of all the material taught out there can be traced back to Mystery.  So even if he falls short on innovation, he’ll always have a solid standing because of the fact that almost everything taught in the community stems from his teachings.

I would really like to see Mystery contribute more to the community in 2009, and have him show us something new.  I think if he could do that, he could re-claim the top spot next year.

To learn more about Mystery, please visit:

5.  Sinn

Yes, we have a new edition to the list this year!  The one-and-only (well, the one and only with two “n”s in his name) Sinn!

2008 saw Sinn break away from his position as Top Instructor at the Love Systems company, and break out on his own.  Since then, the guy has been firing up a storm of controversy, not only with hilarious (and sometimes instructional) videos, but also with his willingness to talk smack about pretty much everybody he hates in the community.

Despite the firestorm around him, I have heard amazing things about Sinn.  I’ve met him once and talked to him on the phone a few times, but its what I hear from a number of trusted sources that really makes me sit up and take notice of this guy.

Just glancing at his amazing blog, you can see the knowledge and skill this guy has, and his contributions to the community seemingly never end.  His core foundations are still in Mystery Method, but he is taking it to new and exciting places.  (Like, the bathroom, for instance.  LOL)

I also hear very good things about his skill as an instructor.  The students who train with him seem to almost always have glowing reviews about their experiences.

I was really looking forward to hanging out with the guy in a more social atmosphere in 2009.  Unfortunately, when he was in town, I was called away because of a death in my family, and that never happened.  But Sinn, if you want to come and party for a weekend in LA, you got my number bro.

Frankly, I think Sinn has the potential to be a real player in the next Top 10 list for 2009.  If you’d like to learn more about Sinn, you can go to:

6.  Swinggcat

Down from #4 last year is Swinggcat.  Why the two-point drop?  Well, the biggest reason is because of Swinngcat’s lack of participation in the community.  2008 saw one new product release, no new articles, no forum posts, no blog entries, and no appearances at any community events.

In fact, the only reason for ranking Swinggcat at all for 2008 is based on his skill as a PUA.  Other than Brad P, I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone who goes out to pick up women as much.  The sheer number of women passing through Swinggcat’s bed night after night is mind boggling.  If the guy ever decideds to write a book detailing every sexual encounter he has, I’ll be the first in line to buy it, because when he tells me about them in person, they are the most funny, fascinating, and interesting examples of master attraction game you can ever hear.

The fact remains that there are very few people in the community as talented as Swinggcat when it comes to generating attraction with a girl at will.  The man is an evil genius.  I believe he updated his ebook in 2008 to reflect the changes he’s made to his game, so he trying to make an attempt to keep teaching the best he has to offer, I just wish he’d be a little more outgoing with his students.

If you’d like to learn more about Swinggcat, you can go to:

7.  Cajun

Another new face on the Top 10 this year is Love Systems instructor Cajun.  I must admit, I have never met Cajun in person, but the buzz surrounding him is louder than a passing freight train.

I was scheduled to speak at the Love System’s superconference in 2008, and Cajun was one of the guys I was secretly very interested in meeting.  Unfortunately, my grandfather passed away, and his funeral was the weeked I was scheduled to attend the event, so I missed out on my opportunity.

That said, I’ve found it hard to find someone who’s had anything BAD to say about Cajun and his skills.  The first example Nick Savoy gave me of the quality of Love System’s instructors was Cajun, and he’s appeared on numerous television shows flaunting his skills.

Not only that, but his students seem very impressed with him.  I’ve been reading workshop reviews of the guy, and I’m hard pressed to find one that didn’t have good things to say.

Could Cajun be a player in 2009?  Quite possibly.  I really want to keep a good eye on him and see what he has to offer.

You can learn more about Cajun at:

8.  David Wygant

I struggled with whether or not to put David Wygant on the list this year.  The man will be the first to admit that he isn’t a “pick up artist,” so to speak.  And there are some traits about him that worry me a little.  However, I cannot argue that the man has game.

First of all, David is probably the OLDEST person on this list, being in his mid-to-late 40s.  Yet, he still is able to get some very attractive women.  The guy is also Mr. Charisma.  Give him a minute to talk your ear off, and you can’t help but be enraptured by the guy.

Out of all the people on the list, David Wygant is most like “Hitch” from the movie.  He doesn’t do bootcamps, focusing on the one-on-one dating doctor style.  David puts more of a focus on Day Game, and meeting women naturally as you go about your life.  He tends to stay out of the bar/club scene (a factor which is older clients really love).  In fact, he says the best place to meet women is while waiting in line!

Probably the biggest reason I decided to rank David in this year’s list is because 2008 saw him actively reaching out to the Seduction Community.  He’s begun to be more involved, not only as a guest speaker at seminars, but also in other people products, making a notable appearance in videos created by both Mehow and Johnny Wolf.

The one criticism I have of David’s game is that I’ve found he tends to rely too much on his dog as prop.  Seriously, he takes his dog EVERYWHERE.  His typical MO is to sit outside with his dog at a coffee shop and wait for girls to come up and start playing with his pooch.  That’s not to say he can’t get a girl without the dog, he certainly can, but this just seems like a lazy technique to me.

That being said, there is no denying David’s skill as both a PUA and a teacher.  His website is full of great information, ranging from his blog to his product.  David is also notable because he gives free lifetime email support to his clients.  The man spends most of his time on his Blackberry answering questions from frazzled clients, fer crying out loud.

I can also see David really striking a chord with the older crowd in the community, since he’s probably the oldest guy out there (legitimately) teaching this stuff.

You can find out more about David at:

9.  Zan

Another mainstay on the Top 10 is Zan, who drops this year to #9 from #7.  Why the drop?  Well, its not because Zan has gotten worse or diminished in skill in any way.  Its just that there were 8 others who I felt had more to contribute than Zan did in 2008.

The fact remains that Zan is still one of my all-time favorite teachers of the art of seduction.  You’ll be hard pressed to find a man more awesome than Zan.  The dude is always positive, always glowing with great energy, and always supportive.  I honestly don’t think I’ve ever met anyone who did NOT like Zan, which is quite a feat considering the politics in the seduction community.

When it comes to philosophy and life outlook, Zan is hands-down #1.  His attitude puts all the others to shame.  The only reason to rank Zan so low is because his strengths as a PUA are SO philosophical, they are hard to teach.  That’s not to say Zan can’t teach them – he does, and quite well I might add.  But someone who does not have good confidence in themselves will be hard-pressed to put them into action.

Zan is also the second oldest person on the list, yet I always see him with very attractive young women.  I’m sure most of you know Zan is famous for having 6 girlfriends, all at one time, who knew about each other AND had sex with each other (and him of course).  Very few PUAs can inspire that kind of behavior in women, and Zan is one of them.

Zan was also very busy traveling in 2008, making appearances at a number of community events.  Zan has always been great at “giving back” to other guys, even when there’s nothing in it for him, which makes him a superstar in my book.  Hopefully, I’ll be able to rank him higher next year.

To learn more about Zan, you can visit:

10.  Nick Savoy

Again, probably another PUA I’d rank higher on the list if I had gotten more of a chance to check him out inn action this past year.  I’ve known Nick for some time, but never really thought of him as a PUA until recently.  Now that he is no longer in Mystery’s shadow, he’s stepped up to shine as a pick up artist in his own right.

Savoy is another PUA who has a girlfriend, who is also a porn star (though I don’t know if she’s just a girl who does porn, or who is actually a well-known adult actress).  So the fact that he can actually have a relationship with a girl who works in a crazy industry like that says a lot about his ability to regulate his relationship when he needs to.

Savoy also put on two super-conferences for Love Systems in 2008, which is a great way to give back to the community.  His operation of the Love Systems company has really given a lot of positive light to the seduction community, such as his famous appearance on the Dr. Phil show, which made him look like an angel when compared to the vile Mine’99.

Savoy is also known for picking up a runway model at the Playboy mansion in 2008, and he’s also getting a reputation for threesomes as well.  Hopefully, if all goes well in 2009, I’ll get to see his game for myself and give him a more fair ranking next year.  But right now, I have to rely on what I hear.

To learn more about Savoy, you can go to:

Other Notable 2008 Milestones

Best Community Portal:  Revolution 31

2008 gave us the rise of Barry Kirkey.  Some may think that’s actually a BAD thing, but gosh darn it, I still laugh my ass off at Barry, even when he’s giving me some undeserved shit.  But you can’t deny that no one has taken the scene by storm like Barry has.  His goof of a podcast quickly turned into the undeniable center of community drama.  His shows range from brilliant to barely listenable, but his genius as a commentator and humorist never fails to come through.  That, and the fact that he’s actually got the discipline to put on a full blown show every day is nothing short of astounding.

Best New Pick Up Artist:  Psych

I never heard of Psych until this past year, but since then I’ve heard nothing but good things.  His videos lampooning RSD’s Alex are things of legend, and his skills have been touted to me by more than a few people who’s opinions I trust.  I hope 2009 will bring us more of him.

Best Product Of 2008:  Brad P’s 30/30 Club

Okay, aside from my own products (hey, I’m biased, so sue me!) I thought the hands down, best product of 2008 was the release of Brad P’s 30/30 club.  Seriously, this course is one of the best, most intense training for in-field pickup that probably exists in the community.  And it just seems to be getting better month to month.  I can’t help but wonder – how will Brad P top this in 2009?  How will ANYBODY top this in 2009?  I guess we shall see.

Best Community Drama: Stephane’s Meltdown

2008 saw a number of amazing dramas unfold, but none better than the meltdown of Stephane and Ideagasms.  I don’t think anything comes close to hearing about the relationship meltdown of the so-called “Spiritual Guy,” him being revealed to be an abusive, drug addled fraud, his ex girlfriend running around causing him to post insanely psychotic jealous rants on his blog, and his lame attempts to justify his behavior.  Not since the Mine’99 Vs. The Return Of Bishop have I had as much fun watching someone self-destruct.  Let’s just hope Stephane stays in Canada and can’t get his hands on a gun anytime soon.

Contest Winners

Craziest Drama Winner:  Paul

Paul had a great write-up about the RSD drama with Alexander and his infamous “Oy, Minger” video.  Congratulations, Paul, you win $100!  Email me for info on how to collect.

Paul wrote:
The biggest drama has happened when Alexander of RSD released his infamous demonstration of what the skillset of RSD instructors really look like.

Here is the video they have repeatedly tried to hide from the public:

This created so much drama in Papa’s head, that he actually contacted youtube to notify copyright infringement (which is stupid, but whatever). This actually caused Donovan from over at Seductionchronicles to lose his youtube account.:)

In case someone wants to review all the drama all that video created over at RSDNation, here you can read the closed thread where Alexander defends the video.
He is so full of shit, that even some of the RSD sheeps had to call him out,lol.

Summary: Biggest drama of 2008 is the Alexander video, which finally proved the level of competence of all the RSD crew: ZERO.



Best New PUA Winner:  J

J made a fantastic case for Glen P. as the best new PUA of 2008.  Congratulations, J!  You win $100!  Email me for info on how to collect.

J wrote:
Glenn P is the best new PUA. I don’t think he’s new in terms of the community, but for blowing up this year…it’s got to be him since Brad’s company just blew up too. He’s Brad P’s coach out here in NYC. He’s made a name for himself based on his reputation…he rarely post on the boards if ever…he’s been idle and only works with Brad’s 30/30 members now. Each of his workshops sell out and his reviews are great. I’ve worked with him and he pretty much runs the workshop for 6-8 guys with assistant coaches helping along the way.

Why do I think he’s so good? Well his postings are all value add. He replied to people’s post. I’ve actually used his eye contact post

Every guy that gets into the community is scared of the hottest girls – he has a post on that too!

He has a bunch of podcast on ApproachAnxiety and audio field reports of him in action from opening, to flirting, to closing. I could put them here but you need to dig and look this guy up cause he’s the real deal.

His workshops consistently help guys get laid or push them far beyond their limits. He’s a very spiritual guy and has a successful career…he’s definitely doing this for the self-help aspect of it for the guys out there. Glenn was once like us. But he’s worked hard and has even contributed to LoveSystems Routine’s Manual coming up with some new stuff.

Also, he does lair lectures. I hear lots of guys get something out of them. You can see his reviews:

If he’s not the best new PUA, he’s definitely on his way to the rankings if he keeps his eyes on the prize…but I don’t think he really even cares…

So to summarize
Head coach for unknown company that just made it BIG
Sells out his workshops
Gets mad respect from the community
His post are value add. He doesn’t post to brag. Even his audio field reports give value…plus who else has posted audio field reports that are over 20 minutes long??
Self help guru – cares about students success
Taught by one of the best PUAs out there right now, Brad P
Rates are reasonable given his reputation

If you don’t know who he is yet…you will in 2009.

Best Product Winner: Twice

Twice made a great case for a product which I too thought was the best of 2008 (excluding my own products, of course! :-) which was Brad P’s 30/30 club.  Congrats Twice!  You win $100!  Email me for details on how to collect.

Twice wrote:
I was an AFC, i’d been reading almost everything out there, i can say i was addicted
to any PUA product, Inner Game, Outer Game, Cold Approach, warm approach, club game, attraction, comfort, everything…results? NONE

Then i “met” online a Guy, actually i’ve just found his site, and it was written that in one month it was going to begin a new program…i fill the form and…WOW it was just amazing!! i’m still doing it, but i’d benn with some number closes, one kiss and one fuck close in 4 months…now after 9 months i’ve had 2 new girls in 6 days, and so many are waiting for ;)

which product? Brad’s P. Club 30/30, it’s just open mind on everything, you take it, you’ll change your life! Every month you work on an aspect of your game, Identity, Fashion , Body language, voice tone, social freedon. one night stand, club game, one month one Big Goal!! with Brad, Glenn and the online coaches who helped you about everything.

The single ebook i consider the best one is with no doubt…”The adventures of Brad P.” the best lay report ever!!

Every info about it is on and


Well, there you go, dear reader.  I hope you enjoyed this year’s list!  Be sure to tune in again next year when I unveil the Top 10 of 2009.

Get Your Free Guide Here!


153 Responses to “The Top 10 Pick Up Artists Of 2008”
  1. Former Brad P student says:

    I saw the latest posts and I just wanted to come on and confirm that Brad P is in my experience the biggest con artist this community has to offer. Ross brings tons more value than him, and say that even though I hate Ross too. Brad P offers very little that is new to the table, and his methods and strategies are complex and see-through. If you want to learn manipulative stuff like what Brad P teaches learn it from the mystery people or the Lovesystems people. They will teach you much better and they won’t fuck around with you either. You will get what you paid for. Brad P is a rockstar looking to make an easy buck in pickup. Someone who is in it for the money and just figures that he bangs a lot of chicks so dudes can learn from him, unfortunately his teachings don’t nearly live up to any sort of value what so ever. The only great thing about him is reading some of his analysis and field reports and that only helps if your a community terminology junkie.

  2. WTF?? says:

    When are these internet “dating guru’s” going to learn that paying money to be affiliated with thundercat is a massive DLV to their value?? As far as I am concerned if your affiliated in any way with Thundercat then your a money hungry piece of shit loser who must be desperate for some new customers to rope in. These guys need to learn that joining forces with thundercat actually exposes them and lowers their value. If they could figure that out then maybe we could put thundercat where he belongs, in any other industry then this one. I want to see this fat fucker go under.

  3. 30/30 student says:

    first of all 30/30 club is legit or brad p wouldnt have made it. as far as who’s better than who that is fucking gay. the list is someones opinion you dumb fucks. as far as saying who is shit and who is legit none of you really know if you dont actually see them game then how can you tell. as far as who is legit thundercat maybe shit but tsb magazine says hes the best. sinn said that he is the best. so he not only respect by one he is respected by other respected puas you dumbshits. as far as what hes teaching. his students get results so enough said you guys have no argument

  4. Hootie says:

    Another BradP experience:

    I attended one of his bootcamps last year, and it was okay-not great nor terrible. It was a good weekend in Vegas since I did other things while learning pick up, but I didn’t really have any expectations and the price of the bootcamp was reasonable.

    One thing that did impress me however-and I mean this with all sincerity and respect-was how BradP moved on after getting blown out set, after set, after set. I don’t think he was doing it on purpose since he was trying the same opener he taught us earlier in the night.

    The one girl whom he did manage to create some attraction, flipped out and blew him out hard when he talked about taking some girl’s virginity while using the necklace as a prop. She stormed off and he tried to chase her down in the casino but then lost her in the crowd. It was all pretty amusing.

    Some criticisms: Although, I appreciated the amount of time we spent in the field, I think just a little more time spent going over the fundementals would made the practical portion of the bootcamp more accessible. As it is, most of the students, including myself, were novices. We did some role playing, but that was the extent of our classroom tutelage.

    I thought we spent way too much time shopping for clothes. And even when I took the initiative to exercise day game, BradP didn’t take the time to evaluate my performance. I didn’t monopolize his time, far from it since I recognized that some of the other students required more help, but I had some sticking points that needed to be resolved and Brad just wasn’t available or interested at times.

    My greatest revelation from the bootcamp is watching an expert getting blown out and rejected time after time. It kept me mindful and humble so I can effectively learn from my experience with blowouts. But in the final analysis, the most important question is did the bootcamp improve my game? And the answer is yes. Albeit probably indirectly.

    I’m thinking about working with Tyler since I’ve seen portions of Blueprint Decoded. Anybody worked with him before?

  5. Johnny says:

    “My greatest revelation from the bootcamp is watching an expert getting blown out and rejected time after time. It kept me mindful and humble so I can effectively learn from my experience with blowouts”

    Thats HILARIOUS!

  6. J says:

    I think everyone needs to be mindful that they should do their own research if they want to work with an instructor. I’m sure everyone has a favorite and dislikes someone. I know I do.

    I see a lot of people debating who’s better than who, but what is the point of that? If you don’t like someone, go with who you do like and write them a good review and help them make some money for what they’ve done for you. But just saying F this F that, F Thundercat…I don’t think that’s very helpful.

    Admittedly, I’ve followed the teachings of Brad P. And it seems as though the 30/30 student is also a big fan of Brad P., however, by not recognizing that other students who work with other gurus also gets results his post really doesn’t help resolve the great debate. The great thing about life is that there are choices out there. No one should be so narrow minded that they believe he is the only one entitled to an opinion.

    I think Thundercat does a great job caveating that this is his view and there may be others out there that slipped by. I am not big on following a bunch of pick-up artist and their techniques and rankings. I’ve been taught to go out in the field and stay off the forums. To tell you the truth, the only people’s performance that I actually care about are my friends and mine. But I do think Thundercat does a great job of putting self-help instructors on the radar so that you can do more research. Think of when you first started…all you probably new were the people from The Game. With the help of list like these, there are more options to choose from.

    Remember guys, this is pick-up. Sometimes I get caught up in the hype and all that, but you have to remember, pick-up is suppose to be fun and help you improve your life. Not cause stress, anger and stupid fighting over who’s your favorite guy…

    If you really are upset that your favorite PUA didn’t make the list. They are still getting hyped. You mentioning him in the comments is still a big help. Like some of the guys say, bad (or any) press is better than no press.

    Thanks for the list Thundercat…but what does it take to get a reply to the email I sent ya!?

    PS Thanks for choosing me for my write up on Glenn P. Watch out for the guy this year!!

  7. Anonymous says:

    >first of all 30/30 club is legit or brad p wouldnt have made it. as far as who’s better than who >that is fucking gay. the list is someones opinion you dumb fucks. as far as saying who is shit >and who is legit none of you really know if you dont actually see them game then how can >you tell. as far as who is legit thundercat maybe shit but tsb magazine says hes the best. sinn >said that he is the best. so he not only respect by one he is respected by other respected >puas you dumbshits. as far as what hes teaching. his students get results so enough said you >guys have no argument


    Even when Brad P tries to post on HERE and pretend to be one of his students, his trasparency is ridiculously obvious. It’s a good thing God gave him talent with music because he obviously left out the part where Brad gets brains. lol.

  8. Johnny says:

    It should be the top 10 COMMERCIAL PUAs…because I know a lotof guys better than those clowns….why is Savoy even on the list?

  9. Samtheman says:

    90% of the pick up community, including people on this list only exist because of Mystery. I think this list is just who can do Mystery Method the best (Except Zan and D Wygnant) and when it boils down to that Mystery will win everytime, over and over again. And if you looking for innovation try having a look at RSD you biased son of a…

  10. Anonymous says:

    For those who don’t know much about RSD these days they are into fractionalization and teaching effective mindsets and attitudes. Sometimes they will give some outer game examples but they basically teach mindsets and attitudes that cause guys to take unconscious actions that result in lays.

  11. Johnny says:

    RSD? LOL cmon man….

  12. Anonymous says:

    Whats wrong with RSD ??

  13. prankster says:

    Ratisse should be number 1. The guy is a beast.

  14. Doc Holliday says:

    Nice to see Brad P getting some love but Sinn should be higher. He’s done more sets than anyone in the community, is the most calibrated guy I’ve ever seen infield, and gets his students results.

  15. Johnny says:

    “Nice to see Brad P getting some love but Sinn should be higher. He’s done more sets than anyone in the community, is the most calibrated guy I’ve ever seen infield, and gets his students results.”

    Cmon dude…

  16. Hootie says:

    So no RSD endorsements?

    From watching the Tyler’s Blueprint Decoded, I think he contributes to a far more worthy ideal than pick up. It just seemed so much more ambitious than trying to get your dating life handled. It’s only through the Blueprint that I’m interested in RSD, but after twenty DVDs worth of material I’ve retained three concepts:

    1) Put your personality out there.
    2) Be in the moment so you can pay attention and calibrate.
    3) Have a good time for it’s own sake and everything will work itself out.

    Yep, after hours and hours and hours this is what I’ve commited to memory and this is what has worked for me. I remember other concepts such value, intention, not putting someone on a pedestal, but intuitively I’ve grasp those concepts beforehand. I don’t think I’ll watch something that long again however.

  17. Johnny says:

    Hottie, RSD is a clown show cmon bro

  18. Hootie says:

    I’ve heard complaints and praises about RSD. My only exposure to Tyler was through the Blueprint Decoded. Based on that alone, I’m curious enough to give Tyler a shot, perhaps not his crew though.

  19. Johnny says:

    I’d rather memorize a few routines than 20 hours of all that rehashed Tolle crap that Church of Tyler preaches about in the blueprint

  20. Hootie says:

    So you’ve watched it too? Wasn’t that the longest presentation? Less would’ve been more in this case.

  21. TC says:

    Hey great post mate. I have been approaching women with the techniques I have gotten from yourself and a few of the other experts out there and although you get the proven techniques I still find that I get a little heart racing when I approach a woman. But I find this to be a good feeling as it puts me into my mode and I really enjoy this as it stops me from getting sloppy.

    It’s like all the big athletes that they say nerves are important before the big game, if they are not nervous they no something is wron.

  22. Stevie says:

    you’re leaving off some important names Thundy. How about him?

  23. Thundercomplainer says:

    Thunderfelatio, I checked out Alexanders video, the guy rocked. You could clearly see the girl was in to him. She had her arm around him right from the beginning. Not only that but she was sooooo pussy.


  24. Jordan says:

    What about IceDragon? He should be on this list!

    I’ve read some great stuff about this guy, and I’m just waiting for his new system to come out.

  25. Climber says:

    Carlos Xuma!!

  26. Michael says:

    I find it amusing that a lot of you are reacting harshly to this list. Why does Thundercat’s opinion bother you? You don’t like that he didn’t include your favourites? Your favourites are not his favourites. If you want to write your own list than by all means go ahead.

    You claim him biased? Everyone is biased. He will promote his friends, you will promote yours, and I will promote mine. That’s how things work.

    I disagree with some of his choices. But I don’t care that we differ on this. I don’t care that he, and others, dislike some of my favourites. I don’t need for everyone to agree with me. I’m happy with my opinions.

    Personally, I like the teachings of Real Social Dynamics. I especially like Tim and Ryan. But I understand that others don’t. And I understand that the RSD instructors prefer to remove themselves from interacting with the rest of the “community”. Which is why Thudercat has not been able to assess them as he has assessed others (and so has not included them in his list (if they would even make it at all)). He even mentioned this very civilly early on in the replies. You attacking him for not including Alex, or Ozzie, or Nathan would be like me attacking you for not including Some Random Guy I Know. You’ve never seen Some Random Guy I Know in action, and he hasn’t seen Alex, or Ozzie, or Nathan in action.

    Just chill.

  27. Johnny says:

    Most of these guys arent even good at pick up

  28. My Intro to RSD says:

    Three PUAs. One goes and talks to a girl. Creeps her out. She walks away. Guy walks back to his friends. They high five and say that was awesome. Then I hear them talk about Tyler and how the guy that went into the set worked with Tyler for 3 days (bootcamp? hence the confidence?).

    This was my introduction to RSD (day game). I guess its good these RSD guys are going out. But wasting time talking about a blown set..why bother? Two guys didn’t do anything. They huddled back up and I guess…and I’m guessing here…to recharge to send one of their own back into a set.

    Now, I’ve worked with some coaches for the Top Thundercat PUA. And I’ve definitely come a long way. I’m no master. But I think I do alright for myself.

    If the guy that got blown out really worked with Tyler and really considered that an achievement…Then maybe RSD really doesn’t believe on the list of top 10?

    Just a thought. From what I saw…and if Thundercat really bases his rankings on students results…I’d have to say he made a good decision leaving them off.

    Or maybe…I should have just opened the girl instead..then perhaps I’d have nothing to write because I would have seen no evil and heard no evil. :)

  29. BlindAries814 says:

    It’s funny how all of you argue who is the best lol… To be honest, no matter how good you are, there is always going to be a girl/set that your not going to get/attract. And I agree with the theory that Mystery is one of the best, if not the best PUA out there.. No matter how much you ignore it, the majority of the information we know about picking women up, derives from Mystery. I personally don’t like Lovesystems…They pretty much stole all of Mystery’s methods, claimed it was theres because they “came up with new material aka openers, routines, blah”. I honestly felt that Mystery should have won that lawsuit. I have yet to read anything good about RSD, or see any accomplishments from their students. As for best product, I would think that Stylelife Academy is right up there. The only downside is that it’s expensive as hell lol…Peace

    p.s. I’d like to see that handicapped guy in the wheelchair from 1 of the David DeAngelo DVD’s in field lol – i think it’s the Cocky Comedy dvd.. I’ll wip out a mangina (penis between your legs) in field if he can pull 10s lol


  30. Rando says:

    First Off, Johnny you need to back wayyyyy the fuck off. I dunno what your problem is but you’ve spammed more than half of this board with your crap. Not once have you given any sort of backup to what you’ve said in more than 50 posts.

    Second, Thundercat’s been doing this list forever and while I might not agree with his List completely he almost definatly knows better than I do. I’m willing to trust his judgement on these guys and, more importantly, he been right quite a few times (almost 100% both in who he picked and who he didn’t *cough* Stephane *cough*) in the past.

    Third, Nowhere here does Thundercat claim to be totally impartial. He says himself that he’s more comfortable ranking the people he’s seen in action than those that he hasn’t. If he didn’t put a single RSD guy into his ranking then maybe its cause he hasn’t seen them in action or just wasn’t impressed. Instead of bugging him about it (or claiming he’s somehow using this as a monney making scheem) how bout you RSD supporters go tell your guys to maybe Game with Thundercat a little.

  31. Chief says:

    Just decided to make my own list.

    My list takes EVERY PUA into consideration from a more outside, unbiased perspective.

    My list is more accurate than any other list out there.

    TOP 10 PUAs EVER:
    1. Genghis Khan
    2. Metallica
    3. Super saiyan Goku
    4. My penis
    5. Eric Cartman
    6. Regular Goku
    7. Some random black guy
    8. Matt Damon (just the puppet from Team America)
    9. ???
    10. PROFIT!

    Honorable Mentions:
    1. Scooby Doo
    2. That guy who ate the most crawfish at the last crawfish boil you wen to
    3. The next guy you see drinking a Dos Equis beer

  32. Paladin says:

    I have personally seen half the guys on this list in action and I think it’s pretty damn good. It is hard to see how anyone will do head-to-head on any given night, but they are all really good. I also gotta say that Glenn P is a cool dude. I met him in LA last fall and I’m glad he got an honorable mention. Keep up the good work Tcat

  33. Damien J says:

    Good list. I think Carlos Xuma and Spencer Michaels should be somewhere on there.

  34. michael UK says:

    I Should be on the top of that list !!

    Going by this guys lame girls and game Im not even a PUA or wannabe just a nnormal guy could pickup the same loser girls like these guys!! and even a one night stand just go for the drunk girl! simple!

    Adam, if your really that good id like to hear from you and go out just you and me lets see what you pull then !

  35. Johnny says:

    Any list which doesn’t contain Discovery, Sasha, IceDragon or Dr. Yen is not worth taking seriously!

  36. Arthur Hawkins says:


    I’m a newbie to your website and I’m enjoying it immensely. Thank you Thundercat, you’re a genius man. Awesome list and I’m glad to see Swinggcat on it. I like Swinggcat’s material because he breaks it all down for you and really gives you practical stuff you can use immediately. Heck, I was even able to use his stuff on online dating sites and was able to come up with my own spin on interacting with women online with great success. Like a lot of guys on here, I also tried and taken many courses from pick up artists, mostly home study courses, but I really wanted to find a site that rated these dating gurus and pick up artists just because there are so many on the internet and it’s hard to really know which ones are worth the time and effort to learning pick up. So, I’m glad to have found your site and keep up the good work. Thank you!

    Now if I can only find a website that rates the best or the top ten, “Online Dating Pick Up Artists” I’ll have it made in the shade with a little lemonade. ))) Do you have any suggestions or recommendations Thundercat? Thank you and I’ll appreciate your feedback.

    Silver Spring, Maryland

    P.S. Just curious, but why didn’t David Deangelo make it on the list? hmmmmm…..

  37. TooSharp says:

    Remember my name. And all u shit talkers are fags for being into this so damn much. Get a life other than message boards and pick-up. I got bitches and never heard of this shit since a goggle search went wrong. WTF is a blog and a form and a pua. I pull bitches and u love to talk about dudes! That’s some fag shit or some bitch shit. U guys get so angry at eachother for liking some one. U are all followers. I mean it look at u. U cAn’t pull bitches by being followers.

  38. TooSharp says:

    Stop following and I’ll stop hating. Everyone in the community is cool with me even though I never been to any events. I read some books about chicks and sone about money because I like them both but I will never become a following bitch like all of u who. I feel like the community is split into two beCause you are all drama loving women who hate on others who you are not cool with because they are takig your business. Fuck that. I am a legend who picks up more tens than any of you because you all spend your time hating on eachother on these meassage boards while I’m out there taking your girls. Anyone who gets chicks is a winner in my eyes whether it b style, mystery, rsd, lovesystems or some othe company your bitch ass loves to follow and defend like u are so e sort of cult or gang. Can’t you see that all these people are suckig ur money and life out of u by telling you ur not good with girls. U know u are good with them but u trust in them instead of listenibg to urslevez. Listen to urslevez and u will not have to be a bitch ass follower and u can improves ur life by eating rigght, going to the gym, mediatating and living ur moms. Instead of wastig ur precious time on these boards sucking ur favorite pua dick. Because you like to suck dick of some one else because u a bitch with no motivation for getting somethig done for urself. Remember my name because I am the beSt pua around becuase I get the woman I want, I don’t hate on others, I’m not a bitch ass follower, I get dough like a pizza parlor, and I don’t suck someother dudes dick

  39. TooSharp says:

    If u respond to tbs ur a bytch because I’m never coming back to thus site again so what u say to me I wi never read u puss boi. Come get some. Reemember my name. I am a legend and u r a follower ass btch that loves dudes. I left my mark on the community and the gAme so whenever you here ur girl telling u that she’s fuckinv toosharp you know what it is. Will have everythig single one of ur chicks lickig my shit by the time my life is over. Step up and Prove how good u are bitch ass followers…. TooSharp’s takiing ur girl while ur to busy writing about some dude cuz ur a hoe, bitch, follower, scallywAg, slut, woman, whore

    TooSharp from the 954 … 954 is the realest.

  40. Nathan says:

    kinda a joke list eh?

    Style? Mystery? Savoy?

    come on man! these guys don’t do shit – and saying that Style could out do anyone else in that list in the field – haha yeah right!

    take away his social proofed lifestyle, fly him alone to any club anywhere in the world and tell him to hook up with the hottest girl in that club without talking about who he knows, or what he does…

    then we would maybe see how ‘good’ he really is!

    sinn, adam lyons, david wygant yeah they are some awesome dudes – congratz to you guys!

    but the others? since when is TALENT based on how famous they are or who they know???

  41. Skillz says:

    Common’ no RSD… this is getting rediculous

  42. adminx says:

    Yeah, I was thinking RSD.

  43. shak3z says:

    What does everyone think about Vin Di Carlo? Is his stuff any good?

  44. Ripper says:

    Hi Fellas,

    I am new to this site. Enjoyed some of the posts and no comment on others.. Got a question for anyone who can provide some insight for me. I am in my mid thirties and would consider myself above average looking. I have always had problems with woman. I have not had a girlfriend in too many years to even remember. I do go out and occasionally get phone numbers, but most of the time they do not lead to anything. We end up texting back and forth and I ask them out and I get the I am busy this day and that day BS.. I cant figure out where I am going wrong as the original interaction when i first got their number was great.. I had this one situation where I was with friends and this one girl who worked at a a store was checking me out from what my friends were saying. I got her e-mail and number and texted a bit and asked her out for coffee, but got the I am busy.. So I continued to text and ask when she is free and she didnt know her schedule for the rest of the week… Anyways what went wrong here?? I dont get it?? Also I need an honest opinion as to what bootcamp is the best one out there?? I really need your honest help on this as I do not have enough time and money to try keep trying different bootcamps and programs.. I would not consider myself to be a nerd or a real antisocial person as I think i have somewhat of a base for myself, but need to build on that base. I heard of people going to bootcamps and reporting that most of the students there are really antisocial and that they need a tremendious amount of work. I dont think i am at that stage in life. I think i just need guidance as to what I am doing rigth and what I am doing wrong.. Also want to mention that I have a few david DeAngelo products and follow his work mostly, but have not had too much success with it.. Thanks for your help in advance!!


  45. P-to-the says:

    lol such bias.
    Leaving out RSD? How the fuck.. Must be personal.

  46. Lol.. you always stir up drama, eh Thundercat?? This blog seems to just attract it!

    Anyway I love reading this every year. I’ve been following since the beginning. Keep sharing!

  47. Paul says:

    I think IceDragon, Harlequin and Gambler should be on this list. Maybe 2009?

    My Reasons:

    IceDragon – Real Attraction Secrets Method
    Harlequin – His new seminars in the US
    Gambler – His Stealth Attraction System

  48. Deft says:

    Vote for Mehow in 2009!

  49. joão says: o cara é brasileiro mais é muito bom

  50. Dad says:

    What is really funny is if you read reviews of AFCAdam and the Stylelife academy people think they both suck.

    Style is a spam/scam artist with his web site.
    AFC half asses his bootcamps.

    Read the reviews.

    This list is totally crap.

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